Another fine mess! Any advise?

[389shell]

Another one for my hubby!

He does wrought iron and has his own business. He fitted some gates yesterday and wired them up, but was due to finish the wiring on Monday. A builder who was on site asked hubby what was stopping the gates swinging out onto the street so hubby showed him.

He received a phone call this morning from the lady who ownes the house, stating that one of the gates has swung out into the street and swung into this builders car. He said it was impossible and went up to investigate. He is sure that someone has been stood on them swinging on it as the weld had snapped right off and the gate had dropped. The builder said the gate was blowing about when he got there (these are huge estate gates that needs 2 people to lift, hence the reason they are electric), and as he was walking up the drive the weld snapped off and the gate crashed into his car. He is now demanding hubby's liability insurance details.

Now short of calling this man a liar, it is possible that kids could have been swinging on it, where does hubby stand, as he is 100% certain that the wind didn't blow the gate. He has been in this business nearly 20 years, and has run this business for 6, this is the first time anything like this has ever happened to him as he is diligent in his work.

I would appreciate any advise given.

Many thanks.

[Conniff]

What condition and year is the van shell? I am thinking what your thinking.

[Helford]

Hi,

Bottom line, there is no legal obligation to disclose his Public Liability insurers details (Indeed, with only a few exceptions there is no legal obligation to hold PL. However, VERY unwise not to.) Disclosing his PL details to this builder could invalidate your husband's cover as it could be construed as admitting liability and prejudicing the insurer's position.

The onus is on the builder to prove, if necessary in a court of law, that the incident happened. Public Liability covers your husband's LEGAL LIABILITY in respect of injuries to persons or their property arising from your husband's business.

Ask the builder to put his allegations in writing and you should pass this correspondence unanswered to your insurer, advising them of full details of the circumstances and your suspicions.

It is not up to you to disprove, it's up to him to prove.

H

[389shell]

Originally Posted by Conniff

What condition and year is the van shell? I am thinking what your thinking.

Ha ha, a J reg rust bucket, and yes you are Hubby has also just told me that the builder asked if he could park on the drive as he didn't trust his handbrake on the hill!

Helford, thank very much for the advise, he is going to do this and also knock on a few of the neighbours houses to see if they saw anything.

[wino]

Just to add... if the builder said he saw the gates swinging when he arrived why did he park where he did?

Sounds to me like he is bang at it.

Your husband secured the gates and showed the builder how they were secured. If the builder had any doubts about it surely he would of mentioned it.

[Conniff]

Ha ha, a J reg rust bucket

If he is hoping to get a new van out of it then he is in for a disappointment anyway as the insurance will only pay market value probably £100 or so.

[389shell]

Thanks for your replies everyone, it is true that he is not dealing with the brightest star in the sky. I will let you know what happens tomorrow

[389shell]

Well hubby has seen the dent and said that you need a telescope to see it! He has had a quote and he said it is £200 including the hire of a car when his car is in.

Hubby reported everything to the police, but surprise surprise, it is a civil matter (criminal damage if you ask me). His insurance company have told him that as his excess is £250 then they would advise to do it without involving the insurance. They would class it as an act of god, and if it went to court then hubby could end up at looking to pay out over £1000 as there was no witnesses.

Hubby has agreed to pay up to £200 on production of a valid receipt for the work. I am fuming!

[gadgetgirl79]

Your hubby should check on autotrader to see if the van is actually worth £200...

Did the van have any other dents in it? If it was in immaculate condition, then I understand him wanting to get the dent fixed, but I'm sure this van must have other damage in 16 years?

If the builder knew the gate was "swinging lose", then could your hubby not claim £200 in damages against the builder for damaging the gate by parking his van infront of it when he knew the gate was swinging!?

[raydetinu]

I would disbute that the gates actually caused the damage in the first place! let him take you to small claims court! he would have to prove this what happened. and you would have an oppotunity to put your side about showing him the gates operation etc.
I dont think he would bother?

[falcon185]

Hi,
just a thought, as the Police state its a civil matter, how about your hubby reporting it as an "Attempt deception" and attempted insurance fraud?? The Police would be legally obliged to make enquiries. There seems to be holes all over the place with the builders terms of events ( and probably his van ) and as previously stated, if he "SAW" the gates swinging, why park next to it?

[Weird Al Yankovic]

I think this is a fairly technical problem that would need the input of your husband to resolve.

He does wrought iron and has his own business. He fitted some gates yesterday and wired them up, but was due to finish the wiring on Monday.

Do you mean your husband only partially 'wired' up the gates as it appears he didn't do so fully as he was going to finish it on the Monday?

One has to assume that for over the weekend there was a weakness in this gate structure.

He is sure that someone has been stood on them swinging on it as the weld had snapped right off and the gate had dropped. The builder said the gate was blowing about when he got there (these are huge estate gates that needs 2 people to lift, hence the reason they are electric),

Did your husband see anybody swinging on the gates?

Welding joints can quite easily snap away if they are not welded correctly in the first place, however, I'm sure your husband is aware of this.

Also, it may take 30 men to erect a scaffold yet one gust of wind can bring the whole lot down. That is no guarantee of security just as two men fitting a gate isn't either.

Was it a windy day on the 18th April up north?

Now short of calling this man a liar, it is possible that kids could have been swinging on it,

What does your husband think? He's the expert.

[389shell]

Hi all, thanks for all the replies.

Weird, thanks for all the imput, he is sure someone had been swinging on them, as I said in his almost 20 years of doing this, it has never happened before. As neither of them have any proof, he is just going to pay for the damage and put it down to experience. As far as I can understand the wiring was all done, it was a couple of adjustments that needed doing, it was actually an electrician that he uses regularly who was doing it aswell.

Ah well, you live and learn.

[LindaLwilliams]

really about the only thing I can say about this is 'what a bad day'. If there is no proof of how it happened, and even if it was kids, the owner of the gates would be liable for damages as I see it.

Has the issue been resolved? And if so, what came to be?

Linda

[demon_x_slash]

'Linda', commercial links are against site rules.

[389shell]

Well, the builder hasn't been heard of since! After hubby agreed to pay for the van to be 'fixed' on production of a valid receipt for the work, it went strangely quiet..............funny that..............