Ufindus Hell

[jowalshy]

I know this isn't about bank charges or anything like that, but last year I had a battle, on behalf of my boss, with a company called Ufindus. I thought that the problem had gone away until just recently.

The problem all started with Ufindus. They contacted my boss to see if he would like a website designed for his business. He said that he would be interested in it and gave them his bank card details. He was told that he would receive some paperwork in the post detailing terms and conditions and some details on the website that they were going to design for him. Nothing was received. Later that year he started receiving invoices from them. I called them and asked them what the invoices were for, only to be told that Ufindus had set up a website for my boss and the invoices were their monthly fee. They gave me the website address and both myself and my boss looked it up. On the website there was a picture of a bathroom of which my boss had never seen before. I wrote to Ufindus espressing my boss's disgust at them using the picture and that he sis not want anything more to do with them. They ignored the letter and just kept sending invoices and then reminders. I wrote to them again stating that if I didn't hear form them again within the next 7 days I will assume that they had cancelled the account, taken the website off line and written off the debt. They wrote back but unfortunatley it was after the 7 day deadline. We never heard from them again. That was back in November 2006.

The saga continues....

Two weeks ago my boss received a letter from Getty Images requesting payment of nearly £1500 for unauthorised usage of a photo.

Yep.. you guessed it.. The bathroom photo.

I e-mailed the company stating that my boss never authorised the usage of the photo and that it was down to Ufindus.

I received an e-mail back stating that as the website was in my bosses name, he was liable for the debt.

Help.... I don't know what to do now.

	Bank Charges You should have started your claim for your bank charges by now. Don't wait. You should send your bank a Subject Acess Request asking for all personal data they hold on you - not just statements. You should calculate all of your bank charges and related interest as far back as 1995. You should send your bank a demand for a refund giving them 7 days. You should commence your legal action adding 8% statutory interest. If you wait for the outcome of the test case, you may not be able to claim like this. you may not be able to claim interest. You may only be offered the difference between the charge and the OFT "fair charge". The repayment scheme will try to limit you to refinds from 2001 only. A repayment scheme will not deal with any bank charges related defaults on the credit register whereas in a court action you can ask for these to be removed and to be compensated for the damage caused to you and your family by them. You should also write to the bank and to the CRA and put all charges related credit entries in disupte and warn them that you will want them removed from the Register when the test case is over. Warn them also that you are likely to be seeking compensation for these wrongful data entries. Full and final settlement Have you previously accepted a partial repayment of your bank charges in full settlement? You will still be able to claim the rest of your money back after the Test case is decided. Get all your information back to 1995 and put in your claim now.

[buzby]

Getty are (quite rightly) tenacious in these matters - however your boss is in the clear. It doesn't matter that his name is on the website, he had neither knowledge or control of the website, and all correspondence should be passed to the web-creators who speculatively used the image.

[jowalshy]

Thanks buzby. I have just called Ufindus and they have confirmed with me that they will be settling the bill. They explained to me that they do have a licence to use Getty Images photos but unfortunately due to human error, they sometimes use photos which do not come under the licence.

[jowalshy]

The saga continues with Ufindus. Received a call from a sales rep on Wednesday trying to get my boss to sign up with them again. they told me that if my boss signs up with them again they will wipe his debt with them clean. We haven't heard from them since November 2006!!!!! Today received another call from the sales rep and he was really quite pushy. I told him that my boss wanted at least a week in order to decide whether to go with Ufindus again, thus enabling me to do a bit of research into other companies that do a similar thing. Sales rep told me that if I didn't give the go ahead with them today he will pass over the money that my boss alledgedly owes to the debt collections department. The sales rep was unbelievably pushy and I felt quite shacky after the call. I informed him that there was no debt with Ufindus. He just got really shirty and explained that the debt is still on his system, therefore they can chase for the money. At the end of the conversation I asked whether the call was recorded - he said that he was now termintaing the call and hung up on me. when he called on Wednesday he told me that all calls were recorded but when he called today it was from a mobile and I have a feeling that it wasn't recorded.

Can I do a Data Protection Act letter requesting a transcript of the calls to myself and my boss?

Can the debt collections department start chasing my boss for the alledged debt as we have not heard from them since November 2006?

[Castlebest]

It doesn't sound like they have a contract with you, you say your boss gave them his card details? what was this for and why haven't they simply charged their fee's to his card? Have Ufindus written to you about any of this?

To obtain any fee's they think you owe them they will need to prove they have/had a contract with you to provide these services, ask for a copy of the contract. if they have no contract they have no claim to any fee's because you have not instructed them to provide any services.

Without seeing the correspondence its difficult to say definitely but it sounds to me like a sales scam and personally I wouldn't touch Ufindus with a barge pole.

pete

[jowalshy]

That is the problem. They just phoned my boss out of the blue at the beginning of last year asking him if he wanted to use their services. According to their terms and conditions my boss should have received a welcome pack which includes a copy of the T&C's, a confirmation of order and a confirmation of service. My boss never received this pack. He only got the initial phonecall from them and never heard from them until they tried to take money of his credit card which had expired. It was then that they started to call him about the account. He then asked them to call me and I asked them who they were etc. I also had a look at the website (which is still on the internet) and was amazed to see a picture of some work that was not actually done by my boss's company. I explained this to the chap who started calling about the debt, I also explained that my boss was totally dissatisfied with the way that Ufindus conducts their business. I also wrote to the company in November outlining all the breaches of their own T&C's that they had done. I also gave them 7 days in which to reply and if they didn't reply within the 7 days my boss would assume the debt written off and the agreement cancelled. They sent a reply on the deadline day, but unfortunatle my boss didn't receive until 2 days later. I expained this to them in a letter and we never heard from them again until last week when they started calling my boss. He then refered them to me in order for me to deal with them. Very scary chap who tried to badger me into taking out another 12 month contract with them. Stood my ground though. But I have a feeling that my boss will now start to get letters from their debt collection department asking him to pay the £980 debt. I would really like for them to provide me with a transcript of the call I had from the sales rep today. Can I do a Subject Access Request for this? If I can, do I pay Ufindus £10 in order to get all I need from them?

	Debt collection library Follow this link to our debt collection library. This library contains templates and advice for dealing with debt collectors who act oppressively or unfairly. This library is work in progress and will be built up over the next few weeks. 17.03.09

	Subject Access Request A Subject Access Request is a demand which you can make to any organisation to disclose any personal information which they hold on you. The right to disclosure of data is provided by the Data Protection Act. There is no time limit. The organisation is obliged to reveal everything they have about you - which you ask for - as far back as you ask for. There are very few exceptions. It does not matter whether the data is held on microfiche, in an archive, on tape, in a cardex system, in sound recordings or in screen notes. Some companies are saying that they do not have to disclose where it would be difficult to do so - "disproportionate effort". This is untrue. Disproportionate effort refers to something else under the Act. If you are seeking bank charges information then you should ask for "all data held on you" and you should make it clear that you want everything as far back as it goes. Do not be put off by excuses. Do not accept being fobbed off. It is not in your bank's interest to make full disclosure to you. This means that it is in your interests to get it. If you have not started gathering your bank charges information yet, then you should start now. There will soon be a big rush once the OFT test case has been settled. Get all of your bank account informtion as far back as possible. At least as far back as 1995. If your bank says that they don't keep data as far back as this, don't accept it. Be persistent. They've got what you need in some form or other.

[Castlebest]

I should wait untill they start sending you letters and reply to those. I doubt they have recorded the sales rep's call anyway and if he calls again just ask him his full name and tell him you are recording the conversation, bet you a tenner he hangs up .

pete

[jowalshy]

Thanks Pete.I don't think that he will call me again as I have a feeling he thought that he was talking to a brick wall as I stood my ground and wouldn't commit to anything.

[jowalshy]

I texted the mobile number from Ufindus that called me earlier (the pushy sales rep) and asked for the guys name and position in the company. I then received a phone call from a manager (so he says) asking me who I was. I told him who I was and that I wanted the name of the person who contacted me earlier. He was a bit shocked to hear that a member of his staff had used his mobile phone in order to call me. I explained the situation to him (pushy sales man trying to bully me into saying yes to the offer the sales man made). He was very appologetic and asked me to e-mail him with the detials. I informed him that I will also be issuing a full Subject Access Request. I explained to him that I will be requesting a signed copy of the actual executed agreement. He informed me that once he receives the Subject Access Request he will provide me with all the information requested in it. Funny though as there will be no signed copy of any agreement with them and my boss, as he never received any paperwork form Ufindus until the bills started coming in back in October 2006. Also as my boss never received any T&C's, was the contract actual enforceable?

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	Subject Access Request A Subject Access Request is a demand which you can make to any organisation to disclose any personal information which they hold on you. The right to disclosure of data is provided by the Data Protection Act. There is no time limit. The organisation is obliged to reveal everything they have about you - which you ask for - as far back as you ask for. There are very few exceptions. It does not matter whether the data is held on microfiche, in an archive, on tape, in a cardex system, in sound recordings or in screen notes. Some companies are saying that they do not have to disclose where it would be difficult to do so - "disproportionate effort". This is untrue. Disproportionate effort refers to something else under the Act. If you are seeking bank charges information then you should ask for "all data held on you" and you should make it clear that you want everything as far back as it goes. Do not be put off by excuses. Do not accept being fobbed off. It is not in your bank's interest to make full disclosure to you. This means that it is in your interests to get it. If you have not started gathering your bank charges information yet, then you should start now. There will soon be a big rush once the OFT test case has been settled. Get all of your bank account informtion as far back as possible. At least as far back as 1995. If your bank says that they don't keep data as far back as this, don't accept it. Be persistent. They've got what you need in some form or other.

[Bigmac versus]

I have had a very similar scenario to this with Customer street who own ufindus and after some ground work have found some things out that just dont add up.
Have you had any more dealings with them?

[jowalshy]

what have you found out?

[Bigmac versus]

Well I decided to give them a try and after some 3 months i havent had a single call from a customer directed from them. I have my own heating/plumbing company within Ayrshire and after looking at the IP addys for hits on my listing lets just say they are from all over the planet.
The funny thing is they will refund all money if your hits dont increase over the initial 3 months so wonder where the hits are coming from because i aint seeing where they are from.

[waroo]

ufindus)customer street
Have had i phone call from these telling me they have had over 260 hits this month for my services, After about 1 hr of trying to sell me there package & listning how fantastic this deal is,I agree but first i ask if i can end it if not happy.Sales man says"of course if your not happy with the service we provide Etc.." i finally agread (god knows what i was thinking)over the phone to take this deal, gave them my credit card detail, they took the set up amount out.explain it will £xx amount a month. & i have a 4 day cooling off period
Decided to read the terms & "cons" on there website www.customerstreet.com(uf indus) just to be sure
Its states
"4.4.1 If you have purchased a Customer Street Package the Confirmation of Order and Confirmation of Service will confirm the average number of views recorded for the area and category you have selected for the Service in the thirty (30) day period before your registration (the "Target View Figure"). Every month we will report to you the number of views which your Customer Street Package listing has received (the "Monthly View Figure"). Internet usage does fl uctuate seasonally and because we aim to provide you with at least the same amount of viewings each month if you inform us that the Target View Figure is less than 80% of the average number of views shown in the Confirmation of Order or Confirmation of Service we will work with you to improve the viewing figures for your package. If an improvement in viewing figures is not achieved within 90 days you will be entitled to cancel the package without further notice.
After reading this i was not happy so rang them to cancel.
Got some recptionist say that it had been noted & one of the sales team would ring in the next 5 day.
Which they did giving it the how fantastic & yes you can cancel anytime "we use a golded hand shake policy which means you can get out when you want"thinking back i reckon he was taking the p**
Anyway

finnaly got t&cs (4 days latter)have had a good read still not happy.
Was told by the sales person (over the phone)that they had 260 hits this month for my service..& if they did not provide 80% of this service i could cancil
BUT FOUND THIS IN SMALL WRITTING ON THE BACK OF THE CONFIRMATION OF SERVICE"the average number of views recorded for the area category you have selected had 8 in the thirty(30)day period your registration(the"target view figure)Every month we will report to you the number of views which customer street package listing have received.internet usage does fluctuate seasonally & becasue we aim to provide you with at least the same amount of viewing each month if you inform us that the target view figue is less than 80% of the average number of veiws shown in the confirmation of service we we work with you to improve the viewing figures for your package f an improvment in viewing is not achieved within 90 days you will be entiteled to cancel the package"
I have not signed any paper work & will be posting a letter Asking to canceling this agrement & asking for a full refund.
it has been five day since i recived the call.
Can anyone let me know how i stand on this matter.

	Record your calls Follow this link to read the review of the Truecall telephone recorder and call manager. This is the Rolls Royce of call recorders. It's a bit pricey but if you buy it with our special offer you will get it at cost: about 20% discount. How much do we make on the deal? - Nothing at all. You can also buy cheaper devices from Maplins. Truecall is the best - but the important thing is to record your calls.

[Bigmac versus]

Stick to your guns and demand a refund but you need to contact your C/C and inform them not to honour any payment requests from them ever.

[mathmagician]

Has anyone else had any issues with this company and how were they resolved. My partner has paid them for a profesisonally designed website but it turned out to be templates with personal information copied in. It was riddled with typos and poor grammar. After my partner went in and edited it (including changing the template to make it a bit more personalised) they went in and changed it all around without informing her. Customer service has been appalling with promises of call backs which never materialise. My partner has cancelled all payments to them and is taking legal advice.
She has drafted her first letter which gave them 14 days to respond however they failed to. She is about to write a second one with a 7 day deadline after which we are going to file court action. This company is an absolute disgrace, avoid at all costs.

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[mathmagician]

Update
They have agreed to release her from the contract but they took £200 for services they didn't provide. The manager she spoke to has said he will listen to the sales call to see if it was mis-sold. Anyone had similar experience or advice?

[Bigmac versus]

Yes I had the same and then told the call was recorded but they have been destroyed. They are a bunch of scammers dont go near them, check the IP addys and you will see what I mean.

[mathmagician]

Yeah I'm expecting something like that to happen. I am pondering whether to send in an LBA and see if they'll cough up. I guess it'll be difficult to prove the mis-selling because we don't record our calls. Although I am about to start!
I know it's not a lot of money but if companies are allowed to get away with it they just keep doing it.
Did you manage to get out of your contract? Or get any refund?

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[Bigmac versus]

They agreed to cancel the contract there and then but no money was returned, im based in Scotland and my web site was getting hits from ALL OVER THE WORLD and i mean everywhere except Scotland I also contacted other companies at the time and heard very similar experiences but in the end put it down to experience and didnt pursue them as I just didnt have the time then. I hope you get this lot and if theres anythig else I can help with give me a shout. You should check the visits and copy and paste for possible future action if you go that far.

[mathmagician]

Thanks for your reply. Unsurprisingly we haven't even had confirmation of the cancellation of her contract. We're going hell for leather because I feel they preyed on my partner when she was starting out and inexperienced. It's not about the money now, but about the principle. If anything comes of it I will make sure we share