Main dealer and warranty

[Surfer01]

In August we purchased a 3 year old Toyota Avensis car from a Toyota main dealer for about £9000. The car had 36000 miles on the clock and came with a 1 year warranty. We were informed that in additon to some small dings in the car being repaired, when the car got to 40000 miles the garage would pay for the service as they said it seemed pointless doing it at that point when in 3 - 4 months it would be due for the normal service. This made sense and we agree to the purchase and a pre-delivery inspection was carried out. On collecting the vehicle we signed some paperwork relating to the warranty and we knew that the warranty excluded "fair wear and tear".
On the sellers side of the document was the following;

I certify to the best of my knowledge this vehicled is \mechanically sound and of road worthy condition and any mechanical faults at time of sale that fail within the scope of this guarantee have been corrected and the vehicle has had a pre-delivery inspection
Followed by dealers signature and date. I was not given a PDI showing what checks had been carried out.

On our side the following;
I have read and understood and agree to be bound by the terms and conditions of this guarantee. I confirm that I have been made aware of all available product options and do not wish to take advantage of any additional cover.
Followed by my signature and date

The car was then booked in for a service Thursday 6/12/07. My wife dropped off the car on the Wednesday afternoon the 5/12/07. After the service it was supposed to go into the body shop. On the Thursday 6/12/07 in the late morning I was phoned and informed that the car was ready for collection. I queried this as it seem very quick for the service never mind the body shop repairs. Anyway dealer phoned back and advised that it would only be ready on Friday afternoon at about 5pm. We then said we could only collect it on the Saturday morning. On Friday afternnon we were told the car would only be ready on the Monday afternoon. A check on the service document shows that they carried out a main service, i.e. spark plug replacement etc on Wednesday afternoon 5/12/07 between 3pm and 5pm. If this is correct why did they only phone me on the late Thursday morning advising the car was ready for collection for 2pm as they needed to valet it first?
Anyway wife went to collect it only to be told that the brakes needed replacing as they were between 85% and 90% worn. To replace the brakes it would cost us £175. The salesman mentioned to me that when they did the PDI at that point the brakes were 65% worn therefore another 20% more wear in a period of less than 4 months is acceptable. Not sure if this would have been acceptable for a MOT at the time. As I was not very happy about this I disputed it with the salesman who then phoned me back and said that they could do the job for £90. In addition the pollen filter required replacing but thyey did not do this either. Strange that they had the car for 4 working days but never phoned us about any addiitonal work.
In my opinion they knowingly sold me a car that would need the brakes replacing within months of delivery therefore they should be paying the full amount for the replacement. In addition, on the service sheet it states that one of the rear tyres will need replacing in the near future. I was quite surprised the amount of fuel consumed as when we dropped it off there was about 150 miles left in the fuel tank but on collection only about 100 miles but the car had only done 7 miles while it was with them.
I smell a rat somewhere and the service is now suspect!
Is there anything I can do to get the brakes, pollen filter and tyre replaced or at the very least the brakes? Is this a case for Trading Standards?

[Dont trust the banks]

So you buy a modern car with 36k on the clock,and when told that it needs money spending on it at about 40k you want some one else to pay the bill????????, The pollen filter may not be due for changing at 40k,and as for the tyre......."fair were and tear"??????

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by Surfer01

. The salesman mentioned to me that when they did the PDI at that point the brakes were 65% worn therefore another 20% more wear in a period of less than 4 months is acceptable. Not sure if this would have been acceptable for a MOT at the time.

It would have been perfectly acceptable for an MoT test. The MOT test checks the function of the brakes.

The wheels are not removed for an MOT test and there is therefore no check as to the amount of brake pad left.

[Hammy1962]

Well, i've seen brake pads go from almost new to metal-to-metal in the space of just a few thousand miles, it all depends on the driver technique and road conditions.

Why does it need a pollen filter? What is wrong with the tyre, exactly.

Use of the word "Knowingly" is a bit of a giveaway, you are already up for a fight.

MOT is "on the Day" and not a report on the vehicles condition for sale.

Fuel reserve, presumably you are gauging this by the miles to empty or trip conputer readings. If the car has been driven around the Dealership by a spotty technician the average fuel consumption will be very high due to the nature of the 7 miles around the Dealership. as you commence normal driving the range will go back up.

Why is the "Sevice" suspect. Do you not think they did it, and if so, why?

2nd trip to the Garage and post No.2 and your already using the "Trading Standards" threat. Under what basis wouold you "Call In" Trading Standards?

Cars cost money, they wear out, why does nobody ever want to pay?????

I get my windows cleaned every month, they are alway's dirty again after a few day's but I don't accuse the window cleaner of not doing his job properly.

Hammy

[gwc1000]

Hi. Personally if I were you, I would take the salesman's offer of doing the brakes for the reduced price, and leave it at that. Brakes are wearing everytime you apply them and I can't see how you could prove how worn they were 4000 miles ago. My other half's daughter (20 years old) wears a set of front pads out every 8000 miles! (Three sets in eighteen months) As stated above it's down to how the car is driven. I can get 60000 out of a set, but I am an old git! As for the tyre needing replacing in the future, ALL tyres need replacing in the future. You viewed the car before purchasing I assume, that would have been the time to mention the possibility of having a worn tyre replaced, but remember you have done 4000 miles on this tyre.

[Surfer01]

Originally Posted by Hammy1962

Well, i've seen brake pads go from almost new to metal-to-metal in the space of just a few thousand miles, it all depends on the driver technique and road conditions. I take your point but the car is definitely not driven hard.

Why does it need a pollen filter? Toyota state that the filter is dirty. What is wrong with the tyre, exactly. Wear and tear on tyre but I don't really have a problem with that however I do have a problem with the fact that although they had to car for 3 full working days plus a Saturday they never bothered to contact me to inform me of the extra work.

Use of the word "Knowingly" is a bit of a giveaway, you are already up for a fight. Not too sure what you mean as the Toyota dealer was aware that the brakes were 65% worn on delviery and should have brought this to my attention especially before they ahnded back the car to me.

MOT is "on the Day" and not a report on the vehicles condition for sale. Fair enough.

Fuel reserve, presumably you are gauging this by the miles to empty or trip conputer readings. If the car has been driven around the Dealership by a spotty technician the average fuel consumption will be very high due to the nature of the 7 miles around the Dealership. as you commence normal driving the range will go back up. This was after the car had been driven home a distance of nearly 18 miles. Plenty of distance for it to re-set itself. Nearly two gallons of petrol is a lot to go through for a distance of 7 miles. The car has one of those guages that tell you how much mileage you have left in the fuel tank. Not 100% accurate but okay. Unfortuantely I cannot pursue this issue anyway.

Why is the "Sevice" suspect. Do you not think they did it, and if so, why? The "service" sheet only shows that the oil and air filter were changed and not the plugs. Originally I thought they had been changed. Manual states that plugs should be changed every 40000 miles. The service sheet is a Visual Safety Report Procedure Guide or a fancy way of saying we check this and that!

2nd trip to the Garage and post No.2 and your already using the "Trading Standards" threat. Under what basis wouold you "Call In" Trading Standards? Car has only been to garage once and they had it a total of 5 days or 4 working days counting Saturday. I posted to find out if I had any case to contact Trading Standards. My post is asking for advice and guidance.

Cars cost money, they wear out, why does nobody ever want to pay????? Not when the car has only been in your ownership for less than 4 months and has not been driven hard and salesman tells you that the brakes were already worn 65% on delivery.

I get my windows cleaned every month, they are alway's dirty again after a few day's but I don't accuse the window cleaner of not doing his job properly. Your windows do not wear out due to cleaning!

Hammy

Shreesh all I was doing was asking for an opinion and advice and whilst some was passed, a lot seem to be an attack because I had dared to question some issues. I assume that some of the posters work for Toyota.

[BIGMTJ1975]

Originally Posted by Surfer01

Shreesh all I was doing was asking for an opinion and advice and whilst some was passed, a lot seem to be an attack because I had dared to question some issues. I assume that some of the posters work for Toyota.

no we work for an independant garage.
[EDITED]

[Hammy1962]

I don't work for a Garage at all.

Hammy

[nez69]

from a main dealers point of view....you are responsible for checking the car when purchasing and mentioning your concerns at that point, anything after then and you will have a hard time.
the brakes would only have been changed if they were dangerous and if they had life (as in this case) they would not have been changed.
anything the garage concerned now offer you is only as a goodwill gesture and personally i would either accept this or get the work done elsewhere cheaper.
these situations always sound harsh but unfortunately this is the real world.
regards

[Surfer01]

Just to let you know, we took on Toyota, produced all the relevant documentation and won. We are now getting a refund, a new tyre and the pollen filter replaced free of charge.

[Hammy1962]

Good Result, you must be very pleased.

One of the reasons why it's so difficult to make a profit nowaday's, nobody want's to pay fair price for anything, it's alway's someone else's fault, or under warranty.

Can I also, gently point out that you probably didn't "take on" Toyota, you "took on" a franchised Toyota dealer who backed down and gave you a refund, tyre and pollen filter. Whether they were truly liable or not is a matter of opinion but Toyota (The Manufacturer) had nothing to do with it.

Anyway, as you say, you won.

Hammy

[Rob S]

Originally Posted by Hammy1962

Good Result, you must be very pleased.

One of the reasons why it's so difficult to make a profit nowaday's, nobody want's to pay fair price for anything, it's alway's someone else's fault, or under warranty.

On the contrary, people are happy to pay a fair price for work carried out that is also done properly. It's when they pay more than a fair price and find the job has not been done properly that they start getting upset.

[Surfer01]

It was Toyota and not the dealer which is probably why I got a result. The dealer was not interested in my problem. Basically because they had misled me was why I decided to pursue it. If they had done a proper PDI prior to delivery, there would have not been any problem.

[Hammy1962]

Well there you are, I do sometimes get it wrong, dosn't happen very often mind you.

Good result then.

Over and out

Hammy