sick pay

[lme625]

hi new here

can anyone give some advice please

i had a week off on the sick (had sick note) my wife collected my pay slip and pay i received full pay for that week. went back to work at the end of the week (Fri)
i did all the wages for the staff and mine as normal but no pay slips were sent (our contract states pay on last working day) so i paid my self full pay. so on Sunday i called into work and the pay slips were on my desk my pay was £29.ssp and £20 tax rebate but for the last five years i have received full sick pay but in my contract it does state ssp only. so i phoned my boss on Sunday and asked them why i only have sick pay they told me that is was stated in contract. i told them that because they paid me full pay for the last 5 years that it is part of my contract.
i phoned again on Monday and was told i would get my full pay at PM i received a phone call from a personnel manager telling me i would not get my full pay and my contract was void? and told me i had to get proof from my doctor of every sick note Ive had. the doctor told me he does not keep records of sick notes.
so on Tuesday i brought up a grievance with my contract on Thursday they offered me a one off payment not for sick pay or overtime but for all the hard work i had done last year and to think about it. and i will receive a letter in a couple of days. i have not decided to except it but i had a note attached to my pay slip saying the payment will be in next weeks wages.

i can not carry on working their because of the way they treat me after 5 years service i already got another job at the end of the month but i will lose £5000. a year

[weegirl]

I had this problem once, and was able to argue the 'custom and practice' route. They also asked me for sick notes, but I just informed them that it is THEIR responsibility to upkeep my personnel file, not mine and I had provided all of the information required.

5 years is a long time for your employers to let things slip. I take it all employees received full pay? If so, you could threaten discrimination.

Once employers break policies, they will find it very difficult to suddently decide they are going to enforce them without an almighty row.

[lme625]

no i think iam the only one that has recived full sick pay but not sure

[Allwood]

Does anyone know if employers have to pay SSP to their employee in accordance the DWP ie if you are off sick and send certificates to employers do they have comply and pay SSP

Or can they refuse to pay this or limited the amount you get because they do not want to pay you in accordance with their own policy.

[Allwood]

Also dose anyone know in what circumstances can SSP not be paid ie if the person is over 60 or other reasons.

[Sidewinder]

SSP is a fixed amount of £72.55 per week, which must be paid by your employer for all sickness after the qualifying period of 3 working days. The company should have their own rules about how you report sick, but basically as long as you have reported sick within the first seven days then they should pay you - you will also need to provide continual proof of sickness, usually a sick note or series of sick notes from your GP. They do not have to pay you if you fail to tell them you are sick within the first seven days. If you don't tell them within this time then they will treat you as being on your first qualifying day on the day that you tell them that you are sick.

Therefore, for the first three (working) days you receive nothing, then £72.55 per week for as long as you continue to provide evidence of sickness up to a maximum of 28 weeks. Beyond that you must claim Incapacity Benefit from DWP.

An employer cannot refuse to pay SSP on the grounds of age. There are grounds for exclusion, but these are mainly linked to qualifying periods and 'linking' periods, or where earnings are insufficient to meet the lower earnings level. Have a look HERE for more complete details.

[Allwood]

Thanks for that Sidewinder my employer has stopped my SSP but I do not know why, I feel that it must because I am getting state pension as when you have passed 60 you do not have to paid NI and I expect that is why it was stopped. I have sent in certificates during the time I was off with an injury, if it not because of my age then it may because I had my hrs changed when I went back to work for a while before I had another accident because my employer would not supply a chair for me to sit while during my working hrs, which would not be out of the ordinary because they have supplied chairs for people who were pregnant. However, it is not because of my age or having my hrs changed then I cannot think why the have stopped my SSP.

I am seeing them soon so I will asked then. I have written and wrote to them several times for this information to no avail.

[Sidewinder]

The rules say:-

Part-time, temporary and casual employees may all be entitled to SSP if they satisfy the qualifying conditions. Agency workers will also qualify if their contract lasts 13 weeks or more. The majority of employees who are unfit for work through sickness may be entitled to SSP, but they must satisfy all of the following conditions:

• have notified you of their sickness within your own time limits or, if you haven't informed them in advance of any time limits, no later than seven days after the first day of sickness
• be employed by you and have done some work for you under their contract
• be sick for four or more days in a row - this is known as the period of incapacity for work (PIW)
• have average weekly earnings equal to or more than the lower earnings limit for National Insurance contribution (NIC) purposes - £87 a week in 2007/08 (£90 a week in 2008/09) - regardless of whether or not they are required to pay NICs
• have earnings on which you are liable to pay employer's Class 1 NICs, or would be liable to pay but for their age

In any one PIW, SSP is payable to an employee for a maximum of 28 weeks.

Your employer cannot therefore have stopped paying SSP on account of your age. Providing that you do work in return for money (ie you are an 'employee') and that you earn the equivalent of the lower earnings level for National Insurance (£87 per week) whether or not you are required to actually pay NI then you should be eligible for SSP.

Any other exclusions are detailed or accessible from the link in my previous post. If your employer is not giving you adequate reason for their refusal to pay, then contact HMRC and ask them for an opinion and if neccessary, assistance in resolving the problem with the employer.

Going back to your first post, did you have a break in service when you reached retirement age? Some companies used to insist on a break in service so that contracts could be changed for those over statutory retirement age - this was mainly so that life assurance, sick pay and other company benefits where age (sadly) increases the risk factor could not be argued under custom and practice. The new age rules have made the break in service less neccessary, as extensions to contracts are now more tightly governed, but I was just wondering whether the fact that you are 60 has a bearing on the fact that you are now arguing over SSP where in the past you have received company sick pay?

It doesn't affect the issue of your entitlement to SSP though.

[Allwood]

Sidewinder that is most interesting what you say, I was employed by this company after I retired and have working for them for nearly 3 years and employed by them. I am going to see them soon due to a grievance that I have submitted regarding due care soon so I will bring up the subject of them stopping my SSP. The gave me company sick pay but stopped my SSP. I have looked the hand book. I really though that because I was retired an in receipt of state pensions that was why the did not let me have SSP.

I will post the outcome after I have been to see them. I needed to know about SSP before I the meeting with them.

Many thanks again for your advice.

[cal37]

Is the company sick pay more than SSP? If so are you sure they have really stopped it? They do have the right to use SSP to make up the company sick pay.

[Allwood]

Yes they have stopped it, I have had zero on my pay slips that they sent me yesterday, so they have stopped all pay, I understand the company one being stopped because you only get it according how long you have been employed by them, they have stopped all pay for four months now.

[Allwood]

Found out why my SSP had been stopped - apparently they had over payed me company pay for the length of services I had with the company, of course they could not tell me this in writing or even on the phone, I had to make a trip into work for them to explain this to me as they told me that it would have been too difficult for them to put it in writing to me, what nincompoops they are!!