Gross misconduct hearing

[daggle]

Hi everybody, I have a disciplinary hearing next week for alleged gross misconduct. The company have followed all the rules regarding meetings and such like but this is the first time that I have seen all the statements from others involved. The problem now is that all the statements contradict almost everything that I have said at previous meetings. This is compounded by the fact that because I work in the motor trade and all the witnesses are sales related I cannot get anybody to be a witness for me. Most of the possible witnesses are sales executives and the company can easily limit the amount of their salaries, so not keeping in with the boss will cost them money. The hearing now looks like being very one sided and I do not hold out much hope of a "fair trial". If I was to resign before the hearing is due would I still have to go through with it, (I have to give one months notice), bearing in mind that I have been suspended for 10 weeks whilst the investigation was carried out. Hope someone can point me in the right direction.

[cal37]

Ok, in answer yes you could still be made to go through the meeting and theoretically you could still be dismissed while working your notice.

You could ask if they would except your resignation but if that fails then you could do this (I’ve not told you this) Go to your doctor, tell him your stressed with work etc or have a bad back anything to get a sick line, then hand that in, you can not be made to attend a meeting while sick, now resign and use your time off sick as your notice period.

Not really a nice thing to do but a practical one.

[daggle]

Thanks for the reply Cal37, we do not get sick pay at work so if I went down that line I suppose I could just leave and not work any notice?

[cal37]

Well you must get at least SSP, also if you just left i could take you to the small claims court for not giving the notice but its very unlikely to be honest.

[Big Dub]

It looks like you feel your employer has decided you are going to be sacked before the meeting even takes place. In this case you could approach your employer and ask them if they will consider a Compromise Agreement, whereby you resign for a package, eg a few months salary plus a clean reference? This would save your employer having to go through disciplinary hearing, appeal hearing and probably tribunal, thereby saving everyone time, money and hassle.

If they accept this, you can approach a solicitor who will deal with this agreement on your behalf, and the best thing here is that the employer is usually responsible for paying the fee to your solicitor.

Check Yell.com for a solicitor who will offer an free initial consultation.

Hope this helps

BD

[daggle]

Thanks for that Big Dub, all along I have felt that this was just the excuse that they wanted to get rid of me. How would I go about this compromise deal? Should I approach my manager or go straight to the HR dept at head office? Also what are my chances of success, do firms do this or would they just bluff it out like they have so far. Whilst on suspension I have felt that they would love me to give in and quit but I have stuck it out, now I have seen the statements made against me I sort of wish that I had.

Does anyone know what happens about the hearing if you do go sick, does it happen in your absence and therefore go on record if anyone was to ask for a reference? Anymore info gratefully received as I will have to decide very soon.
Thanks everyone

[capt1964]

Just been through the same thing. If your sick in my case they can have the hearing without you but a union rep would present your evidence. Something I wish I'd done is prepare a script. Write down everything you want to mention and include it in your summary. They will do this. Theres lots of people on this forum who will help you out with preparing your defence and the terminology to use

[cal37]

No they can not hold the hearing if your off sick, the hearing has to be held at a mutually convenient time and it must be held in work time.

If you’re off sick you are unfit to attend work and you can demand the hearing be postponed.

[Big Dub]

As far as I know, your employer does not have to agree to a compromise, however, if they want to save the hassle of going to a tribunal etc, then it would probably be in their interests.

Hope it works out.

BD

[daggle]

Have just contacted the HR department and they refered me back to the manager concerned. Spoke to him and he is not interested in any form of deal, I get the impression that he just wants me sacked. I suppose I will have to go through with the "kangaroo court" and wait for the result. Thanks for the replies everyone will let you know what happens.

[old_andrew2007]

good luck
Don't forget you can always go down the E.T. route later

[daggle]

Thanks for the support old_andrew2007, not looking forward to the meeting let alone going for a tribunal. Will be on after Monday to find out whats involved in that, (loads more stress I presume) but I really will need to clear my name so will definitely have to go for it.

[scary34]

Hi, I have just gone through a disciplinary hearing and the decision was to sack me for gross misconduct so I understand how you must be feeling. I have appealed against the decision and and currently waiting a reply.

I was signed off work for severe stress and anxiety (due mainly to bullying) and was off work for six months. against doctors orders I returned to work, I lasted 5 mins in the office as I was suspended on the spot pending a disciplinary hearing.

They say that I failed to provide sick notes and failed to notify them of my change of address (as I moved whilst off) so was in breach of contract.

I submitted a sick note every month and also provided a letter from my GP saying that he had issued notes.

I did notify them of my change of address and had received correspondence from other departments within the firm at my new address.

One thing I would like to know is if anyone can help me with the following:-

As they said they didn't receive any sick notes they stopped paying me and I did not even receive SSP. they owe me six months wages and even though they are in receipt of the letter from my doctor, they are still refusing to pay me. I cannot claim any benefits and have been living off my savings, which have now run out, and I am struggling to be able to put food on the table for my son.

[old_andrew2007]

Hi
Not an expert by any means I hope some one with the experience needed can reply to you, am am aware the some members have HR, and trade union experience

Regards

Andrew

[cal37]

I can’t answer about the sick pay issue except to say speak to the CAB about that. If you have been six months without any pay I’m sure there is something that can be done.

In regards of the appeal for dismissal, if what you are saying is true, then the dismissal would be unfair (how long have you worked there?) As for appealing, you would be invited to another hearing. Produce all your sick notes (your doctor can re issue back dated sick notes) and the letter, bring in copies of the letters from the other depts too.

If this fails then go see an employment lawyer.

[alientoo]

Your employer should consider one postponement of the hearing. If you beg off the second date set then they may go ahead in your absence.
Also, you say that the sales employees are basically covering themselves. You can write to your employer before the hearing and request that these colleagues are available as witnesses at the hearing and say you would like to question them in front of the chair. If your employer refuses then you possibly have a care for tribunal.
If your colleagues decline to be questioned use that in your defence. It may not work at the hearing but a tribunal will consider it.

[scary34]

Hi and thanks for replying. I have worked for them for over ten years, my doctor has already supplied them with a letter saying that he has issued continuous sick notes for a valid medical reason. after they were in receipt of the letter I asked my employers when they were going to pay my outstanding salary and they said well you tell us how much you think we owe you and we will consider it.

I have already consulted a solicitor and when I told him what they had said he said that how could I be expected to work out my salary when they are the ones dealing with the pay role.