fined £80 for failure to sorn

[bank_hating_plumber]

hello newby here,

i was wondering if anyone can help duing feb 07 i wrote my car off just before the tax was due to expire, it was taken to a secure compound where it remained until the insurance company settled with myself and the owner of the garage. at the time i had alot of paper work to complete but do recall sending the sorn off, but now am facing a collection company pursuing me for £80.

can anyone help??

thanks

[rippedoffagain]

What is the name of the collection company, plumber.

[gwc1000]

Hi. You say that you recall declaring a SORN. Did you receive a letter of confirmation from DVLA? They normally come two to four weeks after declaring.

[bank_hating_plumber]

hello again and thank you for the replies....

in answer to your question ripped off again - it is a company called phillips collection services based in doncaster, i have contacted them but not the most helpfull as you can imagine.

in answer yo your question gwc1000 i have checked all the associated paperwork from the crash & that vehicle and haven't found a reply as that was the first thing i checked when this all came about.

thanks again

bhp

[rippedoffagain]

I have had this with DVLA, and they threatened me with County Court action, but they never pursued the action as I invited them to prove I had not posted the SORN. I would take the same line with this DCA.

[letshelp]

I have also been victim to this DVLA scam. Someone at DVLA mistyped my address onto the V5 so I never got the reminder, (the vehicle has been off road in my garage for 4 years) The first I knew was when I got a notification that I had a £80 fine, it was on the address that I noticed the error, (well done Royal Mail for finding me). I wrote to DVLA and got their, 'well you should have checked the V5 we sent you and noticed our mistake, its all your own fault'.
I pretty well p*ssed off that I have to act as unpaid quality control for the DVLA, and when I fail to spot THEIR error, I cop a fine.
Well done the DVLA you're worth every penny!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by letshelp

I have also been victim to this DVLA scam. Someone at DVLA mistyped my address onto the V5 so I never got the reminder, (the vehicle has been off road in my garage for 4 years) The first I knew was when I got a notification that I had a £80 fine, it was on the address that I noticed the error, (well done Royal Mail for finding me). I wrote to DVLA and got their, 'well you should have checked the V5 we sent you and noticed our mistake, its all your own fault'.
I pretty well p*ssed off that I have to act as unpaid quality control for the DVLA, and when I fail to spot THEIR error, I cop a fine.
Well done the DVLA you're worth every penny!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not quite, as there is no requirement in law for DVLA to send a reminder. That they omitted this courtesy is no defence. As RK, you remain liable - reminder or no reminder.

You are asked to check the V5 when you receive it. It is not unreasonable for DVLA to ask you to do this a inform them of any errors. You should see some of the standards of writing people use on forms - it is no surprise that there are sometimes transcription errors.

[letshelp]

I understand that Pat, but as Im sure you know it then goes on to say that if you don't receive an acknowledgement i a couple of weeks, please telephone our rip off telephone number and tell us. I would suggest it was in their financial interest NOT to send an acknowledgement, because if you realise they havent sent one, they get you telephoning their rip off number, or, they hit you with a fine for failing to declare SORN. Its nothing but a scam and only a Government agency could get away with it.

[patdavies]

No, you are confusing the two issues.

V5 details

On the V5 it states very clearly

If any details are wrong enter correction in Section 6, sign at Section 8, and return Certificate to DVLA

There is no requirement to ring them on any number - rip-off or otherwise.

SORN renewal

There is no obligation for DVLA to send any sort of reminder. The RK remins liable for either VED or SORN regardless of whether any reminder is sent.

Again, whilst you can ring a national rate (0870 - not a rip-off premium rate) number to tax or SORN over the phone, you can equally well do it by post or by taking it to a Post Office or free on-line.

I accept that the renewal form does state that you should contact them if you do not receive confirmation within 4 weeks (BTW, it is confirmed almost instantaneously by email if you SORN on-line). However, what most people, the DVLA and Capita (who administer the continuous taxation regime) fail to realise that is that the Interpretation Act 1970 is completely against them.

This Act states in S.7 (my bold)

7. Where an Act authorises or requires any document to be served by post (whether the expression "serve" or the expression "give" or "send" or any other expression is used) then, unless the contrary intention appears, the service is deemed to be effected by properly addressing, pre-paying and posting a letter containing the document and unless the contrary is proved, to have been effected at the time at which the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post.

DVLA/Capita simply saying that they did not receive it, does not constitute proof to the contrary.

If anybody is eventually taken as far as Court for this offence, it is not dealt with by a civil court and a CCJ - it is a matter fro Magistrates' Court as it is a criminal matter. Burden of proof in a criminal court is "beyond reasonable doubt"

[Conniff]

Originally Posted by patdavies

This Act states in S.7 (my bold)
7. Where an Act authorises or requires any document to be served by post (whether the expression "serve" or the expression "give" or "send" or any other expression is used) then, unless the contrary intention appears, the service is deemed to be effected by properly addressing, pre-paying and posting a letter containing the document and unless the contrary is proved, to have been effected at the time at which the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post.

Conversly, they could also ask you to prove they did not send a reminder.

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by Conniff

Conversly, they could also ask you to prove they did not send a reminder.

No, because there is no duty to send a reminder.

Regardless of the existence or receipt of any reminder, the RK remains liable for ensuring that a vehicle is either taxed or SORN'd.

[letshelp]

Thanks for the clarification Pat, whilst not wanting to open a debate on telephone numbers, 0870 is at least 10p a minute its certainly not local rate, it was implemented with the sole intention of making money from enquiriers to the DVLA, and in my mind that makes it a rip off number. I read somewhere that the DVLA make abou 2,000,000 a year from this number.
The reason I am annoyed with DVLA is that, my V5 arrived sometime ago, and yes I failed to conform to DVLA's instructions, I did not notice that they had botched my address, I wouldn't think to check as it had arrived at my house, so I missed the first notification of a fine, the Royal Mail manage to find me with the second notification telling me the fine had now increased to £80. It was on the second notification that I realised they had botched my address. I wrote to tell them this, thats when I got the its all your own fault etc.......
Further to that, I cannot be alone in having other things going on in my life to think, if I don't receive a SORN acknowledgement within 4 weeks, Ah I must telephone those nice people at DVLA and chase up my SORN. In all honesty, I'm too busy and have no chance of remembering.

[buzby]

0870 was never a LOCAL number - it was a NATIONAL number (local being 0345). That said, OFCOM have now decreed that since the cost of phone calls has fallen so much since their introduction, they should not be described in this way. 0870 numbers will soon be mandated to be charged at no more than the equivalent cost of a call to 01, 02 and now 03 codes. This latter code is where the existing 0870 users may end up.

As to the process. Of course it is unfair and unreasonable. That's why I indent voting out those cretins that came up with the idea and allowed the persecution of innocent motorists without just cause, at the next election.

[robin9342]

As to the process. Of course it is unfair and unreasonable. That's why I indent voting out those cretins that came up with the idea and allowed the persecution of innocent motorists without just cause, at the next election.

I never voted for those cretins in the first place