Sorn+clamped+ OFF ROAD

[clever dicky]

Hi All, first post.

Nice to know there's a growing community spirit aghast at the police state we've almost become.
My vehicle properly sorn off road and MOT'd normally resides in my relatives back garden. Since we had to clear a load of rubbish weeds etc. i moved it on to our service road for the day. It just happened to be the day our secret police nepalese friends, enlisted to do dvlas dirty work decided to pop round with there scanners.And sure enough it was clamped. Rang them and got the bad news, it was a public road ??? and almost convinced these scum should tow away it away for good as a favour.
So Got clamp off (without damaging it) and moved it into garden they came past early morning looking to tow it but couldnt. I rang them again and agreed to pay. Two hundred pounds. 120 refunded within week of getting tax.
Thing is it was and is a service road. I was straight on to local council who agreed, but when I said why I rang they said it didnt matter still liable. (obv a cut from dvla) County council were a bit better. Took two weeks but eventually got a little copy of a ordanance map showing road was outside their blue line and Highways chap agreed is UNadopted. Have written to NCP scum asking for refund but no word yet. I cant realy go to court for 80 quid, so what are the options.
To say its all about preventing crime and terrorism is crap. Its about money.

[Conniff]

Hi dicky and welcome

I cant realy go to court for 80 quid,

Oh yes you can, give them 7 days notice to refund in a letter before action, and then go through with it.

You will also get back the court costs and anything the council charged you as well.

Do it - don't let it run on.

[clever dicky]

No Charge from council, but where / how do I start. (Is there a how to take to court section or threatening letter templates anywhere)

I did wonder if it might be worth writing to the DVLA prosecuter at my local office - portsmouth. I now no its pointless to ever try and ring the dvla again.

[Chesterexpress]

An unadopted road is still part of the public highway and therefore subject to the usual traffic laws.

[patdavies]

But the definition of a publivc highway is different for VED and VRM. It is a road "maintained at public expenses" - which an unadopted raod is not.

Vehicle Excise and Registration Act S.62(1) refers:

• “public road”—
  (a)
  in England and Wales and Northern Ireland, means a road which is repairable at the public expense, and
  
  (b)
  in Scotland, has the same meaning as in the [1984 c. 54.] Roads (Scotland) Act 1984,
  
  
  

[clever dicky]

That reminds me, there is a bit in the road traffic act - direct gov version that mentions roads 'adjoining' public road, so even an unadopted road if it runs parallel or touches a public road which could be anything outside .
I think they 'mean' when they say off road private land... like a farm or more likely private estate.
But another thread yeah.


interesting if anyone has similar issues or success

[patdavies]

The Road Traffic Act is totally irrelevant to VED and VRM.

The Act requiring these has it own definition - quoted above.

Off course, if it's not taxed, then it needs to be SORN'd.

[clever dicky]

no idea what vrm means, however in my case it was sorn'd.
difficult bit is getting them to accept an un adopted road is off road - by definition.

[skbuncks]

Originally Posted by clever dicky

no idea what vrm means, however in my case it was sorn'd.
difficult bit is getting them to accept an un adopted road is off road - by definition.

VRM - Vehicle Registration Mark

skb

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by clever dicky

no idea what vrm means, however in my case it was sorn'd.
difficult bit is getting them to accept an un adopted road is off road - by definition.

As I understand it, the Council have stated that the road is unadopted and not maintained at their expenses. If they haven't stated the last bit, then write to them again and ask who is responsible for the upkeep of this road.

Copy this and quote the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act to them.

All that matters is that the road concerned is not maintained at public expense.

[clever dicky]

Yes they have said (confirmed over the phone) and then chap sent me a little copy of a map. Although he tried to tell me it actually didnt matter - in regards to dvla. I said it did.
It IS an unadopted road and is owned & maintained by a local housing assoc.
Whatever is said or done that is, and more importantly WAS the situation on the day of clamping. However they may weasel their way out of it.

The controversy is that the ncp drones prior to me checking this, assured me that they have already detailed areas of roads supplied from (the same) council.
They're either up each others backsides or in each others pockets.
However the council cannot lie about an un adopted road. It is what it is.

[please return my money]

in council terms an unadopted road means that it is not normally maintained by the council. You need to check whether in the course of their duties on this occasion they were employed by the local authority or by the housing association to which you refer.

Where I live the parking wardens covering the public streets often cover private property too and so you need to check this out before you do anything good luck xxxx

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by please return my money

in council terms an unadopted road means that it is not normally maintained by the council. You need to check whether in the course of their duties on this occasion they were employed by the local authority or by the housing association to which you refer.

Where I live the parking wardens covering the public streets often cover private property too and so you need to check this out before you do anything good luck xxxx

Sorry, but this is irrelevant; we are talking here about clamping for no VED, not parking. These cowboys were employed by the DVLA.

If it is not on the public highway, it does not need VED and cannot lawfully be clamped.

Write (not phone) and demand repayment of your £200 (or £80 if that is all that is outstanding). Point out that the place where they clamped the vehicle is not a public highway within the meaning of the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act. Give them 14 days to pay you.

If you here nothing, repeat the letter but add at the top "Letter before Action" and in the text add a paragraph that if you are not paid within a further 14 days, you will raise a court claim against them with further notice.

[clever dicky]

Sorry to drag this old post up again when so many others are clearly having your own troubles.
Continuing on with the saga, all ready reading up on small claims etc. when I get a letter from the DVLA telling me I have ben reported for driving with out ved.

After carefully checking date on the receipt I thankfully kept, I had bought ved after scum clamped me unlawfully and made me hand over monies until I had, I fired off a nice long letter telling them they had made a mistake (another one) and that I had tax etc. on the day.

Reply was that if I bothered to check, my tax was incorrect therefore pay one hundred an eighty pound (again) or go to court. In my haste to buy tax on the 20th of the month, for said ncp clamping scum I had been sold a tax from the 1st of the NEXT month, (May I think). So on the day i was reported 28th I was 'technically' using no tax.
Rather unfair, so I've offered to pay a months tax (at the higher six month rate) and hope they'll settle for that.

This is all just going too far. . .

[Conniff]

They are making it so patiently obvious now that they are under 'strict' orders to make as much money as possible and not even take death as an excuse.

If that is not the reason, then they really are the thickest people to ever operate in a department.

My betting is that it is a combination of both.

I wonder when they will start calling 10 times a day like some others I could mention.

[clever dicky]

Update:

[EDIT] at DVLA are still taking me to court AND they have the extra months tax I paid, as (part payment) to the £189 fine what a bloody cheek.

I tell you, the way things are now, the 42 days and now they want to legally acept anonymous witnesses in courts. THIS IS NOW A POLICE STATE.

I cant believe why anyone hasn't announced this on the 10'clock news.
Even in lawless Mugabe's regime you can fight back.
What chance does anyone have in THIS God forsaken country, that so many fought and died for, when your fellow countrymen will take you to court for being sold the wrong date on a car tax.And you offer to pay.

[Hobbie]

Unadopted Road is NOT covered by the RTA 1988, so is therefore not liable for VEL or INS, no matter what. also a little unknown fact is if the road is listed by OS as a "UNKNOWN" or "UNNAMED" road it is also not covered regardless if it is maintained at public expense.

[clever dicky]

just waiting to here back from NCP- if I ever do. Sent them letter from housing assc who do own the road confirming its owned by them , not council AND not maintained by public funds. They say its not for paarking in but hey.
DVLA pased thebuck completly.