Currys wants me to goto manufactuer

[bluelotus]

As a foot note to this, Currys are now taking Samsung TV repairs in house. Previously this was not possible due to Samsungs own policy, not Currys.
Frankly, does it make a difference who completes the repair? As long as it is fixed within 28 days that's it.
Personally, if they don't fix it within 28 days I'd be happy, it means I get a brand new replacement!

[veto]

i guess you missed the point , going to the manufacturer directly voids any contract you have with the shop you purchase from , any more faults with the repaired tv and you havent got a leg to stand on with the shop .

i was well aware of currys deal with samsung to fix there TV's , problem is dont care , my deal was with currys .

as an update to the situation , got a phonecall from currys last week saying samsung dont have the parts so im entitled to a credit voucher for instore

[bluelotus]

Originally Posted by veto

i guess you missed the point , going to the manufacturer directly voids any contract you have with the shop you purchase from , any more faults with the repaired tv and you havent got a leg to stand on with the shop .

i was well aware of currys deal with samsung to fix there TV's , problem is dont care , my deal was with currys .

as an update to the situation , got a phonecall from currys last week saying samsung dont have the parts so im entitled to a credit voucher for instore

I'm very pleased you got the offer to replace your TV, you imply that having gone to Samsung you had voided your contract with Currys...strange then that they are replacing your set. Fact is that Samsung are/were operating as agents for Currys and carrying out the repairs. How this would void your contract is beyond me. It would appear that many are of the opinion that the large retailers are all too keen to not offer a good service to their customers, patently a daft thing to do as that will guarantee a loss of business.

[demon_x_slash]

The OP didn't go to Samsung, though - they dealt entirely with Currys. It was Currys tech support that was telling the OP (wrongly) to go to Samsung. Only the customer service lady (from Currys) backed up the OP. The customer service lady (from Currys) obviously arranged for a repair (through Currys, even though they may use Samsung engineers) and now that the repair seems impossible, the OP will get a new TV/refund due to Currys responsibilities under the SoGA.
If the OP had followed the incorrect advice from Currys' tech guys, and gone straight to Samsung, the manufacturer, with whom the OP has no legal contract whatsoever, the legal contract between the OP and the retailer, Currys, is in jeopardy. If Samsung had replaced the OP's TV, the item would be different and would no longer be covered by Currys' original legal obligations. If that new TV subsequently went wrong, the OP would have impaired recourse under the SoGA.

[retailerspointofview]

Originally Posted by demon_x_slash

The OP didn't go to Samsung, though - they dealt entirely with Currys. It was Currys tech support that was telling the OP (wrongly) to go to Samsung.
not "wrongly". the TV has to LEGALLY be fixed to the standards of the original manufacturing process. the manufacturer is the best person for the job. there is legislation about warrenties which ensure maufacturers warrenties and services do not affect consumers rights
Only the customer service lady (from Currys) backed up the OP.
what was probably not mentioned was that the helpline said call this number direct as for data protection reasons we cannot do this over the phone long distance. as they want your details to arrange a repair. the store staff then said to the customer how about you use our phone and call them yourself. or seeing as ou are beside me there is not data protection issues.
The customer service lady (from Currys) obviously arranged for a repair (through Currys, even though they may use Samsung engineers)
and they do use samsung
and now that the repair seems impossible, the OP will get a new TV/refund due to Currys responsibilities under the SoGA.
and they would have anyways. but refusing to call the manufacturer just wasted time and petrol.

If the OP had followed the incorrect advice from Currys' tech guys, and gone straight to Samsung, the manufacturer, with whom the OP has no legal contract whatsoever, the legal contract between the OP and the retailer, Currys, is in jeopardy.
even if the customer goes directly to the manufacturer or through company repair services there is some legal bits and bobs that tie a manufacturer to the company to do with warrenties where maufacturers have to inform retailers of the actions so it does not affect theconsumers rights concerning SOGA.
yes there is no direct bind between the buyer and manfacturer. but by using the manufacturers warrenty it will not affect the bind between the buyer and seller

legally to offer a warrenty or repair service direct to the customer the manufacturer has to inform the seller of what repair/replacement was offered. if un replaceable or repairable the item is then either returned to the buyer or directly to the seller who then offers other remedies

If Samsung had replaced the OP's TV, the item would be different and would no longer be covered by Currys' original legal obligations.
If that new TV subsequently went wrong, the OP would have impaired recourse under the SoGA
wrong: again there is a separate act about warrenties which ensures the consumers new product is still covered by the original contract.

what is WRONG is to get it repaired by a unwarrented, un authorised independant party. then you may have lost your rights if the seller refuses to accept the repair as of manufacturing standard quality.

my advice is to use warrenties or repair services offered by the company. do not go to independant repairers.

i personally had a person with dell machines just a couple months old and they ask me to fix it. because i am not Dell or any of its manufacturers if i attempt to repair it they are leaving themselves vulnerable to losing their rights. yes i am fully trained to manufacturing standard and i can get the manufacturing parts. but there is no legislation that binds me to Dell to ensure customers SOGA rights are intact. So if dell refuse because there is no legislation between independant repairers and sellers then it is risking your rights.

ofcourse you could take dell to small claims and use me as a witness, showing my crudentials and showing the machine in question which is using Dell's own parts and pictures of my workshop to show i have the right tools and everything. which could ensure you keep your rights.
but that depends on the judge.

[StormWarrior]

wrong: again there is a separate act about warrenties which ensures the consumers new product is still covered by the original contract.

Name the Act ?

[Parva]

ofcourse you could take dell to small claims and use me as a witness, showing my crudentials and showing the machine in question which is using Dell's own parts and pictures of my workshop to show i have the right tools and everything. which could ensure you keep your rights.
but that depends on the judge.

'Crudentials' is probably the correct word ironically. What are the right tools? Maybe I should get my Black and Decker drill out and place that at the side of my PC and say "I can fix it!"! Crud fits quite well. What qualifies you as an expert witness?

[veto]

retailerspointofview

im sorry , but everything you put down was assumptions made about my situation , all of them were wrong .

i was over ten miles away when the CS lady in store called samsung for me , had nothing todo with my details .

samsung are one of the only manu's to fix there own sets with currys , thats the deal 'they' have with 'them'

my deal was with 'currys' , not samsung , had i went straight to samsung and gotted a new tv , any faults and im required togo straight to samsung again .

i didnt care who 'currys' got to fix my TV , as long as they sorted it with whoever they have contrcted to do repairs .

to end this thread .... i now have a brand new 40' samsung lcd , of which i poped a bit more cash in to get .
currys replaced this , so any more faults and im still tied to currys , not samsung .

[retailerspointofview]

Originally Posted by BankFodder

Write to Curry's. Inform them formally of the fault and the trouble to which you have been put so far.
describe the fault as fully as you can. Give them 7 days to visit and repair or to inspect the TV after which you will have it independently examined and bill them for it.
writing to curries wastes about 4 days postage, add on the weekend, and time to read the letter and book a engineer visit.. 7 days is too short, try 14 as that is reasonable time in most peoples books. (apart from currys/pcworld who are 28days as reasonable)

If they do not respond then have the set inspected and diagnosed by an official Samsung repairer.
hmm.. so call samsung to get them to inspect/diagnose fault.. read on as i come back to this point
Get the report and estimate for repair - you may have to pay for this.
yes external parties do charge labour. so be warned
Send the report and estimate to Curry's. Give them 7 days to repair the set or else you will have it repaired by the official Samsung repairer.
again ill come back to the point about the official samsung repairer
If they do not respond, have the set repaired, pay for it and then send all bills to Curry's for payment. Give Curry's only 7 days to pay and then sue them.
again 7 days for post is not long enough. if you want to stick to this then ensure it is special/recorded delivery.
some court cases get thrown out purely by not allowing companies enough time to action. honestly 7 days.. everyone knows how slow royal mail are!!
Do use an official Samsung repairer. Don't settle for some cheaper outfit.
using manufacturer officials ensures work is done to manufacturing standard and so the company (currys) cant just say you breached your rights by using shoddy repairers.
The trap to fall into would be to use a cheap repairer as if then broke down again, everyone would be able to disclaim on the guarantee and you would be left in a very difficult position.

Their legal reps are DG something or other. Very obstinate and difficult bunch who will cave in in the end.
Your position is unloseable. It is a disgrace that you are having this kind of trouble with a company such as Curry's which used once to be a very company - they have lost their way.

ok back to the point above. the advise is good, to contact a samsung official. is a great idea.

a more legal option is to ensure that the official is an employee of samsung with the authority to remedy items under guarantee's and under SOGA.

manufacturers as a separate legal act have to by law ensure their guarantees and services do not affect consumers rights, including SOGA.


someone that is just trained and qualified by samsung but is not an employee has less legal requirements to remedy faults and keep it all within consumers rights.
so ensure it is a samsung employee for best legal position.


second point. instead of giving currys 7-14 days to inspect/diagnose. and then contact and pay a samsung official. and then another 7-14 days to contact currys/samsung official to remedy it.

why not contact samsung manufacturer instead of external officials. no 7 day here 7 day there.. no pay upfront and sue later. no risk that official may have affected your legal rights.

REMEMBER contacting samsung manufacturers engineers rather then external officials does not affect your legal rights.

BY LAW using manufacturers guarantee's/services does not affect your SOGA rights.

even if trained by samsung if they are not authorised or employed by samsung they dont have to care about consumers rights. but manufacturers and retailers do

[retailerspointofview]

here we go

Consumer Direct - Using a guarantee

bottom of the page the manufacturers guarantees and services must clearly state that they do not affect consumers rights

ill find the legal act which came in march 2003 to ensure manufacturers guarantee's dont affect consumers rights.

maybe then you will realise that the retailer can use the manufacturers guarantee as a remedy.

[gyzmo]

Originally Posted by retailerspointofview

maybe then you will realise that the retailer can use the manufacturers guarantee as a remedy.

In what way?

BTW, the "legal act" you are referring to is the Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2003 which states that guarantees are contracts and legally binding on the guarantor.

All they do is offer ADDITIONAL rights to consumers and are best used only where those rights are in force but statutory rights are not applicable (e.g, where an item is faulty after ten years, and the guarantee states a replacement wil be given in such cases).

[retailerspointofview]

Originally Posted by gyzmo

In what way?

BTW, the "legal act" you are referring to is the Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2003 which states that guarantees are contracts and legally binding on the guarantor.

All they do is offer ADDITIONAL rights to consumers and are best used only where those rights are in force but statutory rights are not applicable (e.g, where an item is faulty after ten years, and the guarantee states a replacement wil be given in such cases).

seriously you have no clue. reading about how to load a gun does not make you a expert sniper.

reading the french dictionary does not make you french.

unless you see the laws, acts, regulations in the real world you will see their true meaning and not the grey area called a book.

manufacturers guarantee's do not affect consumers rights. pure and simple.
retailers can use the manufacturers services as a remedy. if the retailer afterwards refuses to deal with the fault then the retailer is in breach. manufacturers contact the retailer concerned with what remedy they have given the consumer. (which is why they ask for proof of purchase to know who to contact).
so if the item is a new product the seller has to accept this.
because no money changes hands between consumer and manufacturer then there is no new contract between the manufacturer and consumer.. the old consumer/seller one remains.

the contract between buyers/seller only ends with these options
recind of contract
breach of contract
passed life expectantcy of product.

the manufacturers guarantee does not affect consumers rights so the consumer is not breaching the act.
the consumer receives no reimbursment. refund, full or partial from the seller so the contract has not been recinded.
the manufacturers guarantee lasts for 12 months. apart from consumables the life expectancy of most things is about 3 years, and upto 6 if your lucky.

if the retailer refuses to deal with it after the manufacturer has dealt with it then the retailer is in breach.

so use the manufacturers guarantee.

going to external repairers(not manufacturer) is the iffy area as they are not regulated. and so they can affect your rights

manufacturers services are there as a means if getting your product repaired to high standard in a more prompt method then your legal rights. the retailers know this and they know that they can use the manufacturer as their repair method. and so they do. consumers refusal to use retailers repair method can be seen as a breach on the consumers side not the retailer. as the retailer has offered an option which is fast convenient and free. obviously after the manufacturers guarantee period the retailer has to find other methods to remedy the solution

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by retailerspointofview

unless you see the laws, acts, regulations in the real world you will see their true meaning and not the grey area called a book.

I think you have this (as usual) back to front. An Act of Parliament or subsequent regulation or SI is absolutely black and white and written down (in what, for the sake of argument, we'll call a book).

It is only when retailers attempt to bend the law to suit themselves that the so-called 'grey' areas emerge.

manufacturers guarantee's do not affect consumers rights.

They are in addition to the consumer's rights under SoGA. They may not replace or curtail those rights in any way.

retailers can use the manufacturers services as a remedy.

As has been said before, (ad nauseum) this is absolutely true. What they cannot do is require the buyer to use the manufacturer's services - the retailer remains wholly liable for remedy.

Please, please tell me that you understand this - I cannot see how it can be explained more simply.

manufacturers contact the retailer concerned with what remedy they have given the consumer. (which is why they ask for proof of purchase to know who to contact).

Where in the name of all that is Holy does this latest nonsense come from?

There is no requirement whatsoever to fill out those little guarantee cards so beloved by manufacturers for gathering marketing information. There is no legal requirement to provide a proof of purchase to a manufacturer - although it can often speed up the process.

so if the item is a new product the seller has to accept this.
because no money changes hands between consumer and manufacturer then there is no new contract between the manufacturer and consumer.. the old consumer/seller one remains.

Time and time again, this has been explained to you and still you spout this arrant nonsense.

If you purchase product XYZ serial number 1234 from a retailer then your rights under SoGA relate to your contract to purchase this particular item.

If it breaks and you send it to the manufacturer, who doesn't repair it but sends you a new one with a different serial number - then your contract with the retailer for the item you bought is ended as you no longer have ownership of the item contracted under SoGA

If the retailer sends it to the manufacturer by way of remedy and it is replaced, then your rights under SoGA remain with the retailer as replacement by the retailer is a possible remedy under the Act

the contract between buyers/seller only ends with these options
recind of contract
breach of contract
passed life expectantcy of product.

the manufacturers guarantee does not affect consumers rights so the consumer is not breaching the act.
the consumer receives no reimbursment. refund, full or partial from the seller so the contract has not been recinded.
the manufacturers guarantee lasts for 12 months. apart from consumables the life expectancy of most things is about 3 years, and upto 6 if your lucky.

if the retailer refuses to deal with it after the manufacturer has dealt with it then the retailer is in breach.

so use the manufacturers guarantee.

going to external repairers(not manufacturer) is the iffy area as they are not regulated. and so they can affect your rights

manufacturers services are there as a means if getting your product repaired to high standard in a more prompt method then your legal rights. the retailers know this and they know that they can use the manufacturer as their repair method. and so they do. consumers refusal to use retailers repair method can be seen as a breach on the consumers side not the retailer. as the retailer has offered an option which is fast convenient and free. obviously after the manufacturers guarantee period the retailer has to find other methods to remedy the solution

This is just so much nonsense, I'm simply not going to try and make sense of it.

[Darren]

Originally Posted by retailerspointofview

seriously you have no clue. reading about how to load a gun does not make you a expert sniper.

reading the french dictionary does not make you french.

Buying a business degree does not give you a brain.