Currys laptop and Sales of goods Act

[sjc1985]

Ok, this is quite long so bear with me please...

My dad bought a laptop from Curry 1/9/04 so its not 3 years old now... We have rang Consumer Direct who say that we have a case but I need more help than that.

We have had a problem with the laptop since day 1, whereby we cannot use our laptop without it being in the mains... so its not portable... We rang their helpline and they told us that it was a manafacturers problem and we needed a "bios flash upgrade" to change the settings and to go to the website, download what was needed and install it... This was done by my dad and my other half, whos pretty knowledgeable with comps.

When this didnt work, we rang back and they told us the would take the computer and repair it because as well as not running without mains, the mains connector in the back was loose and it kept turning off. They told us the faults were probably related and they would fully test the system and return it in FULL WORKING ORDER.

They decided to send it back to Packard Bell to replace, who replaced the motherboard, fixing the shorting out problem, but not allowing me to use it without the mains, as promised. I started speaking to Customer services via e-mail as it was an unreasonable repair, stating quite clearly the sales of goods act and they werent interested.

After this several incidents happened meaning that we had to holt the claim.. My mum lost twin boys, my daughter died etc...

A few weeks ago we got in contact with Consumer Direct who say that we have a case and not to worry as we have 6 years to claim.

We were told to get an engineers report by Currys at our cost and to send that to them.. We cant find an engineer that will do it before it gets sent to Currys and we dont see why we should pay for a report that costs more than the computer is now worth when it is a standing fault since we bought it.

My understanding of the sales of goods act is that our contract is with Currys and it is their responsibility to give me an item of working order, which this is not. It also says that if a repair is attempted and it is unsatisfactory (which it was as it still doesnt work as it should) that I am entitled to ask for a refund or replacement.

I also made half the payments on an extended warranty but stopped it when the computer came into dispute as I knew that the warranty woulnt cover any other computer and my warranty didnt cover this fault so I couldnt understand what I was paying for. It wouldnt even have started until the computer was a year old, which is wasnt when it first came under dispute.

I have asked for my money back as the extended warranty was never enforced and I have paid over £100 to have a computer which doesnt work and a warranty that doesnt cover my already faulty computer!!! They have refused.

Im waiting to take it to court, just not sure on how to word court papers etc... All I am asking for is a replacement of my computer of the same spec and My warranty money back. We dont think thats unreasonable.

Sarah
-x-

[blacksheep1979]

I think as you have left it so long and a long gap between it being 'fixed' and now that you are going to have a hard time if it goes to court. You may get lucky and Currys decide to settle out of court.

[sjc1985]

We thought the same but Consumer Direct says that it doesnt matter... as we have a 6 year gap to work with its not a problem, we have 6 years to claim. We just need someone to point us in the right direction as were not sure what to do.

[rosiecotton]

You do have 6 years under the statute of limitation, however not taking any action won't do you any favours. You'll just have to hope that the judge is sympathetic if it does go that far.

The warranty issue is tricky. You signed up for it and to be honest you can't just stop paying for it because it didn't cover the fault that occurred. Unless there is something wrong with the warranty or it's been misrepresented, I don't see that you have grounds to get a refund for this.

Re. the laptop, the Sale of Goods Act states that goods must be of satisfactory quality, fit for the purpose and as described. Your rights can last for up to six years from purchase as stated above, however this will not cover normal wear and tear. You are entitled to a repair or replacement in the first instance; if the repair fails you are looking at a replacement to the same value that the laptop would have been had it not become faulty, or rescission of the contract - which is a partial refund less an amount for wear and tear, so you would have to allow for having a fair bit of use from the product.

You would be unlikely to get a brand new replacement without having to make a contribution at this stage. A consumer cannot have betterment, i.e. be in a better position than they would have been in had the goods not been faulty. If you got a brand new laptop now, you have effectively had 2.5 years use from a laptop for nothing.

I would also doubt that they will offer you a new laptop out of goodwill, as it would potentially cost them more to do this than to rescind the contract and offer a partial refund (which they are entitled to do if the other remedies are disproportionate, i.e. cost them more).

However I can see them offering 3 potential resolutions:

1. they can offer you a replacement of the same value as your laptop would have been had it not been faulty

2. a new laptop and you make a contribution to the cost

3. rescission of the contract, they take back the laptop and pay you a partial refund allowing for the use you have had

Sorry can't type any more - programme on TV! - but hope this helps a bit.

[blacksheep1979]

Just to clarify - my point was meant to be along the lines of rosiecottons - ie that yes you have up to six years but as you have left it a long period of time without pressing the matter you may have a hard time and a judge possibly asking 'Well if it didn't work why has it taken you 3 years of no correspondance?'

[edinburghbeerbucket]

Sorry to be pedantic here, but I have to clarify the statute of limitations thing here.

You have 6 years from the time you discover the fault to make a claim about that fault. i.e. your 6-year clock started ticking when you found out that the laptop had to be plugged-in to work.

I would seriously consider filing a small claim based on the SOGA. If it does end up in front of a judge, (s)he will award you a partial refund of the purchase price, based on how old it is etc OR require Currys to perform a free repair/replacement (at their discretion).

However, if Currys settle out of court - which they probably will, let's face it - there's a chance they'll give you a new laptop.

Don't waste any more time going into stores etc, write to head office in Hemel Hempstead. Probably a well-worded letter before action will get the result you're looking for.

Let us know what happens!

[wendyandkeith]

Currys have answered my complaint about my faulty laptop but they have missed some vital points in there defence... where do i put the points that are wrong? Iv got an aq and im not quite sure what to do with it? Thanks

[wendyandkeith]

The original thread was written by my daughter, the url is Currys laptop and Sales of goods Act

[rosiecotton]

Originally Posted by edinburghbeerbucket

Sorry to be pedantic here, but I have to clarify the statute of limitations thing here.

You have 6 years from the time you discover the fault to make a claim about that fault. i.e. your 6-year clock started ticking when you found out that the laptop had to be plugged-in to work.

No, you don't.

You have to be able to prove that the fault was inherent in the product when it was purchased, therefore you have six years from the time of purchase.

[rosiecotton]

What did you ask for and what was their response?

[sjc1985]

Hello, my parents have scanned the court papers and defence, would someone be able to look at them please as they dont have much time left before the AQ needs to be back x

[blacksheep1979]

put them up as an attachment on a post with personal details blanked out.

[sjc1985]

How do I do that please?

[sjc1985]

Ok, we dug up everything we could on this... The following link is the original report after the computer was returned for repair in July 05... It states that the fault was a major power/ critical defect and that it was a faulty power socket, so they replaced the motherboard (in no way shape of form do they say it was a battery problem)... when the computer was returned, it still didnt work.

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...efence0005.jpg

The next link is one of the early letters written to them regarding the complaint...

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...efence0008.jpg

The next letter was the one written in October 06 to currys after we spoke to consumer direct who told my dad to resume action... There is a time gap between the letters... In that time, my mum was bedridden with identical twins, she lost them both, had to have numerous tranfusions to save her, and then my baby daughter died at 19 months 10 weeks after the boys, so you can understand that the faulty laptop was the last thing on our minds... There are 2 links to this next letter...

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...efence0006.jpg
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...efence0006.jpg

The next two links are the court papers we filed

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...85/defence.jpg
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...efence0001.jpg

And the following links are the defence filed by Currys... There are several differences between what we say and what they say...

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...efence0002.jpg
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...efence0003.jpg
http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r...efence0003.jpg

Will post a list of the differences later... If someone could have a look and let me know what they think, would be great, and then I can let my dad know,

Thanks

Sarah
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[rosiecotton]

First of all, one potential issue is that you cannot demand a replacement machine if that is a disproportionate remedy and it would be cheaper for the company to offer you a partial refund (rescission) of the contract. I'm not sure if this would be the case - I don't know how much it would cost Currys to supply a replacement machine, obviously it's not the shop price.

I understand however that they are not admitting any liability and are claiming that the fault is due to normal wear and tear (i.e. battery life). It would be down to you to prove in court that the fault is not normal wear and tear.

I'm not an engineer so I couldn't possibly comment on this. The judge will have to decide based on the evidence in front of him. What do you have to put forward in your argument to go towards proving that the fault is not normal wear and tear?

[sjc1985]

Hiya, we have email corrospondence from 2/3 months before the June date that they are claiming my dad first complained about the fault... The first few months he was told it was a BIOS problem with that particular machine and that he had to download all the settings for this etc, etc, and he did so several times but the fault wasnt fixed. The June date they give was the date arranged for it to be taken off and repaired...

They also have the original price we paid wrong and we have the receipt to prove this...

We also have email correspondence and telephone calls from after the repair, with us still complaining about the problem...

Also, we have a reciept from a repair on a different computer where it was found that the battery was at fault and it came back saying that on the repair sheet... The repair sheet for this one says there was a critical powerfault which they repaired, but when it came back to us, it was still doing it. I also dont think they mentioned about the repair being done... But it seems to us that if to start off with we were sent to a website for the manufacturers BIOS settings fault and then it was repaired for a critical power error and its still doing it, then the problem was obviously a manufacturers fault???

Were a bit stuck to be honest on what we do with the AQ etc and it has to be back this week so were not sure what to do with these wrong points etc...

Any help asap would be appreciated xx

[rosiecotton]

Their defence is clearly that it's an issue with the battery, and giving an example of the battery life, that it is normal wear and tear. They obviously haven't inspected the machine in the condition it is now in, so I can only say that they appear to be making assumptions here.

It's down to you to prove that the goods are faulty and this is not down to normal wear and tear. "Critical powerfault" does seem to indicate more than just a battery fault, although the time that has passed since this diagnosis won't help your case, you will have to hope that the judge is sympathetic to your circumstances.

Their argument is that this is normal wear and tear. Your argument is that it is not. The onus is on you in court to prove your case, and not on Currys. You will need to gather as much evidence as you can to show the judge what the fault is and that it is not something you would expect to occur through normal use. An independent engineer as they suggested is the easiest way to prove this one way or the other, and the costs of this can be added to any claim provided it does not exceed £200. Without an independent report, you will have to rely on what you have to present your case - the previous fault report and your description of the fault. The judge won't be a technical expert and will have to rely on the evidence in front of him.

Did you let Currys know that you could not find an independent engineer?