Philips LCD TV - still under warranty

[maker21]

Can anyone advise? Trading standards have been of little use so far although they are still trying for us.

We purchased a Philips LCD TV in Dec 05 from Currys (I cancelled the extended warranty before taking delivery of the TV).

In May we noticed a straight black line from top to bottom in the picture. As it was past 30 day currys told us to speak to the manufacturer.

Philips tell us we caused the problem by pausing a DVD for extended time, and the defect is a burn on the screen.

An independent TV engineer has looked at the TV on my behalf, and assures me that it is not possible to image burn a LCD TV owing to the way it produced the image on the screen.

We've relayed this back to Currys in the hope that they will do the right thing (via Trading Standards and my credit card company). But does anyone have nay info or advice that will help if they continue to "fob me off"??

Thanks

[Bookworm]

Yes.

When you buy goods from a trader, such as a shop, market stall, garage, etc, you enter into a contract, which is controlled by many laws including, the Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended by the Sale & Supply of Goods Act 1994 and the Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002). The law gives you certain implied, or automatic, statutory rights, under this contract.

The Sale of Goods Act 1979 (as amended) says that goods should be as follows:

• Of satisfactory quality.

This means the goods must meet the standards that any reasonable person would expect, taking into account the description, the price and all other relevant information. In some circumstances, the retailer may be liable for any statement made by the manufacturer about the goods.

Satisfactory quality includes the appearance and finish of the goods, their safety and durability and whether they are free from defects (including minor faults)

• Fit for the purpose

that goods of this type are generally sold. They must also be fit for any specific or particular purpose made known to the seller at the time of the agreement.


As described - goods should correspond with any description applied to them.

Is this TV of satisfactory quality? The way to find out is the test of reasonableness, and it works like this: Ask the average person in the street: "I have bought this tv for xxx pounds at xxx date, now, it has developed this fault, do you think it is reasonable that it should fails now?" If the average person says "No, it is not reasonable", there's your test.

Ok, you don't actually need to go and ask. I think we can all answer this one here. TV's what, 8 mths old?

So now, here's what you do. You go back to Curry's, and you tell them to stop trying to BS you, you are now aware of your rights under SOGA, you're not happy they try to fob you off to Phillips when it is THEIR responsability. The law considers that the seller of the goods is always liable for breaches of contract, such as goods being faulty, so, even if there is a guarantee, the seller must rectify the faults if you ask him/her to.

Go and kick backside, my friend.

[rjstott]

Apparently it is possible to get 'screen burn' on LCD TV's. It is commonly called ghosting and is just that. So it wouldn't be a solid black line which sounds to me like a failure of the driver electronics for a particular digitally addressed screen line.

Check your manual for any warning about this 'ghosting' issue as it might be reversible by either leaving the screen off or exercising the screen.

Did you in fact leave a DVD paused?

Curry's as already advised are your key port of call under sale of goods act.

[Rich44]

its not screen burn per se as there is no phosphur to get an image burnt onto it what it is is that certain pixels get "lazy" and sometimes it takes an image longer to fade, this is inherrant with the technology CRTs suffer from burn so do plasmas but it is not always caused by leaving a DVD in pause.

99.9999% of DVD players if left on pause will eventually kick in a screensaver unless you had already turned it off (which im sure you havent)

A solid black line is more than likely a hardware failure and unrelated to any "user damage" so you should make the claim there is no way using the TV could cause that kind of problem

[reidnet]

DRG Retail are one of the worst lot to deal with, they seem to think they are above the law..
Have had a couple of run ins with this lot over the years, but stick to your guns, the law is on your side.

I had to resort to twice raising Small claims against them, and as soon as they were served on them ..their whole attitude changed and they were very helpful..

[maker21]

Thanks for the input guys.

Actually we havent paused any DVD on it. I'm sure as we've not had the opportunity to even watch a DVD on it as we were extremely busy after Feb owing to additions to the family.

Trading Standards have confirmed with the independent engineer that it is an address line failure hence a manufacturing defect. They also say that Currys could offer to repair or replace at their choise.

But having had all the hassle and poor customer service from both Philips and Currys, I would much rather have a full refund, plus cost of the independent engineer's report.

To be honest, I'll not be purchasing any Philips products in future, nor will I buy from DSG retail. I'm sure other retailer and manufacturer will have their problems but I'll try to stick to the smaller independent retailers who actually do provide good customer service (although I may have to pay more for the product)


Does anyone know if I can insist on a full refund rather than a repair or replacement?

[tom3131]

No unfortuanly, your right to a refund ends when you "accept" the goods, this is when you take them home and use them as your own without reporting any faults. About 2-4 weeks in my opinion.

You are enititled to the "damages" caused by the breach of contract.

These will be:

1) Provide you with a working TV, whether it be repaired or replaced with old or new.
or
2) Pay you a certain percentage of the sale price back, ie: if they think you've had 30% of the TV's life usage then they may just offer you 70% back.

3) I think you'll end up going to court if you want the engineers fee back.


Regards,
Tom3131.

[big blue one]

currys have a policy that if a repair goes over 28 days then it is automatically exchanged. let them send it to philips. the stuff never returns in 28 days.

[orchard]

If you can stand it, i would agree with the idea of letting currys send it away to philips. if it's brought after oct 05 it has to be dealt with in 28 days.

[carl hargreaves]

I have a philips plasma, purchased from currys, it has had an intermitant fault for about 5 months, and the unit is only 7 months old! i have been in conversation with mastercare (currys aftercare service), what i have been told by them, and may help you out is, I quote, "from the day you report the fault you need to call at least once a week (not letting it go over a week between calls) even if the unit is away for repair! by doing that as long as we have had a chance to repair the unit at least once, after the 28 days you will be entitled to exchange the unit" i am still ongoing with my tv at the moment (waiting for parts which are back ordered).
the only thing I would advise if you are thinking of an exchange would be to consider the fact you may get one that has allready been repaired, if that is the case, you may be better keeping the one you have (after its been repaired of course) as you know what its been through since new, and you would not know any thing about the replacement, it could have been on for longer periods of time, or been mistreeted.
i hope this helps you a little in your quest! good luck

[gulag]

I personally would try to hold out for your money back. I too have a Phillips LCD TV, that also had a black line across the screen, I first noticed this after about 9 months. The set went back for repair (which took 3 months), when I eventually got it back it appeared to be fine but now nine months later half the screen suddenly went magenta. Phillips don't care because the set is out of warranty and there service agents want £465 just to collect it and do an estimate for the repairs . Phillips have offered to cap the repair costs to £300 but I do not want to have to spend £300 every nine month, does anybody know if I could use sale of goods act to get some money back? as every one I have spoken to do not consider this of satisfactory quality.

[leidenschaft]

i have a similar problem with my laptop that broke after only 1 month. bookworm has already given you the ins and outs and was really helpful.
but you are definately entitled to a repair or even refund. the tv broke after less than 6 months in what case currys need to prove that the fault was not present at time of delivery. you can probably demand a refund on the grounds that they have been extremely unhelpful and might even be entitled to compensation because of the excessive delay (if it does go to court).
if you like you can PM me and i could send you my letters i have sent to currys. however, be prepared that you have to go to court. also, currys is liable and not the manufacturer (they even confirmed that in their letter to me). let me know if i can help you in any way.

[rosiecotton]

As Tom 3131 says, you won't be entitled to a refund because the Sale of Goods Act only allows a limited time in which you can reject the goods for a full refund. In the case of a TV, it would be a matter of weeks.

The trader is entitled to offer either a repair or replacement in the first instance, and it's down to them to decide which to offer.

If the repair or replacement item then fails, you will then become entitled to rescind the contract, which basically means a refund less an amount for any wear and tear (benefit you have enjoyed from the product).

Within the first six months since purchase, it is down to the trader to prove that the item is NOT faulty - the onus is not on you to prove the fault.

Ultimately as it's a civil matter the only way to force them to do anything would be to take them to court.

Hope this helps.

[jimmypaged]

20 years ago i briefly worked for the currys/dixon service group which was known in the trade as (^isat%rcar) seems things are the same. flash headlines,showroom staff pre programmed with replies and little service backup.ps i am mellowed now .

[boneyM]

This problem sounds familiar. I have a Phillips 32" lcd tv, and I have a black line running down the whole length of the left side of the screen.

I took out the extended warranty from Comet when I bought it, as the lady said the only part that can be replaced on these tv's is the on/off button.

If the guy comes out on friday and says it needs to go away for repair, I shall be most unhappy with Comet.

Boney