'C.R.A.'s Archiving Our Data Over 6 Years Old'

[Allwood]

'O' Yes, of course they want everyone to do a monthly check, think of all that revenue from us the punter, I feel sometimes that they have a lot to do with data going missing, it is a money making racket and that is a fact.

These people are less than honest.

[renegotiation]

I will make the Information Commissioners Office my first port of call and see what they say. Then, I need to draft a good letter for my CRA Subject Access Request's. I'll just wait and see what Equifax and Callcredit have to say. I'm thinking I should have no legal difficulty forcing them to remove my data that no longer need. I just don't trust them!

[renegotiation]

I received a wholly inadequate reply from Equifax a few days back and absolutely no response from Callcredit whatsover. My original letter template was completely unambiguous so the feeble reply from Equifax and lack of reply from callcredit are likely to be answers in themselves. Hmmm. I wonder what that answer could be? I have sent a copy of my original letter to Callcredit (registered mail this time) demanding a response and another unambiguous letter to Equifax asking for a fuller answer! Just for the record, I have pasted Equifax's lacklustre response below. They have basically just stated what most of the nation knows and ignored my question.

[andrew1]

They are like blinkin politicians the way they answer these questions - never a straight answer! You ask them a question and they come back with " No, the question that should be asked is......." then go on to answer that one ( with a touch of " The fact of the matter is...." ) Jeez they make you mad!

[renegotiation]

Originally Posted by andrew1

Jeez they make you mad!

Yes, but they certainly picked the wrong person if they think i'm just going to skulk off.

Originally Posted by car2403

sue the companies giving them the information, I say. (I have!)

I plan to do all I can. I got a lot of things on my plate at the moment! One thing at a time for me. Still got to start my CCJ set aside as well.

[renegotiation]

I just got back from a small holiday. Hi everyone. A quick update on my enquiries on whether the CRA's archive data over 6 years old on settled and defaulted accounts. Equifax never replied to my follow up letter with big red letters in certain places. I had to prevent any mock ignorance from their next response. Their silence is a full admission for me. Callcredit never replied to my first letter at all. They will get my kiddy letter sent off today. The Information Commissioners Office told me they wanted to see my letter from Experian and what I got back from Equifax and Callcredit. I will give it 2 weeks and then send off everything I have. In the meanwhile I am going to start harassing Equifax on the telephone. I am going to insist on speaking to a manager and ask why I haven't been given an answer to my query. Unfortunately, I don't have a number for Callcredit. I do have an email address for a manager though and he will be getting the same treatment. I am then going to write to my MP asking him why we need 3 of these companies. In my eyes we certainly don't. It feels like I am fighting on a zillion fronts at the moment, but will persevere. Plod, plod.

[renegotiation]

Did anyone follow up on the issue of C.R.A.'s archiving our data after it is removed from credit reports? I eventually got a response from Callcredit, after much pestering, that they did indeed archive our data. They refused to say for how long though. Equifax flatly denied that they archive data. Again, they had to be pestered quite a bit. What makes me dubious is that when I pushed for a letter from them signed by a manager 'relevant' to the said issue they started waffling! I suspect that they do indeed retain this information. As I made clear in a previous post, Experian have already admitted that they do indeed archive our data. As with Callcredit, they wouldn't state for how long. Probably indefinitely in my opinion. I believe that the issue of archiving needs to be regulated. There needs to be a set period where our data is still on their systems after it has been removed from our credit reports. They shouldn't be allowed to keep our data indefinitely. For me, this period should be 2 years at the absolute maximum. I am now ready to present my case to the I.C.O.. I just wanted to be sure that no one else had taken the bull by the horns and pressed on with this issue.

[renegotiation]

I will wait until Monday and if I hear nothing will compose my complaint and send it off to the I.C.O.. I will post it up on this thread.

Just for the record, this is the response from Callcredit:

Dear Mr,
Thank you for your e-mail; I am sorry that you did not find my response adequate. I confirm once six years have elapsed on settled and defaulted accounts, the credit account records are removed from all credit referencing databases. However, I further confirm these records are not immediately erased from archives, research datasets, or disaster recovery facilities. I trust this clarifies matters.
Yours sincerely,

It would have been nice to get this response without sending multiple letters and emails though. All my correspondence was completely clear from the off. They seemed to continually think I was concerned about the future of my own ruined credit report and not just a concerned citizen. All they kept on saying was 'it won't be visible on your report', 'it won't be visible on your report'. Well I knew that and the best way to keep it like that is to permanently erase the data after a set period of time.

[MARTIN3030]

Interesting comments.
I pressed them on the same issues,following a fall off of a 6 year entry.The response was the same.But they did give me a reply with a FOC endorsement to have a new copy of my file.Ha Ha.

This is an interesting one.
If we look at Banks arguements now as they frantically change their stance,specifically saying they are not obliged to provide info pre 6 years.
But more importantly they say "WE HAVE NO OBLIGATIONS TO STORE IT"
So surely that tells its own story.

They were not too concerned before,based on the assumption that they were protected under the limitation act from pre 6 claims.

However after they were challenged under section 32 (c) of this act-which turns the tables on them,it was a different ball game.

The other issue is the microfiche arguement.
Both Abbey and Barclaycard were visited by the Information Commissioners Office and had their systems analysed,after claiming their archived Microfiche data fell outside the Data Protection Act.
The Information Commissioners Office overuled on it saying that it did.

Maybe worth trying to find out how Mycall store their archived data-but I guess they wont be quick to tell.

If it can be established that they can be challenged on this,then I would go down the Court Route for an order.

[Newborn]

I wonder if the lenders keep the data just in case the debt can in the future be proved not to be statute barred? Such as B-Card selling debt to Cabot after 3 years then debtor makes payment 1 year on so they could argue the need to retain for another 6 years.
However I would argue that the OC should be ordered to destroy everything after 6 years from the default or their own last interaction with the debtor. If they sell the debt on it should be the DCAs responsibility to store the said records (not licence the OC to hold it!).
This of course does not apply to CRAs as they have clear time limits for publishing data. They should be ordered to destroy (non-recoverably)everything after 6 years from the default or court action (12 years for mortgages).
There is also, as already pointed out by martin3030, the subject of the storage medium. A while ago many firms (as well as hospitals etc) went down the route of using a cheaper WORM (write once read many times) medium where data is stored forever and udeletable unless the disc is physically destroyed. This can lead to firms breaking data protection law by default.
On the other hand however, if the lenders and CRAs destoy everything, then the DCA may feel free to re-register the default as a new one knowing the debtor will have no proof of the old one and we know who the CRAs believe. So the CRAs would argue they need to keep data for consumer protection to prove the debt was paid.
What is needed is a well thought out bill together with one governemnt regulated CRA and no court action unless the debt is properly registered with that CRA. Then proper record keeping that protects both parties.

Newborn

[sillygirl1]

If such a bill was to come to power IMHO it should contain the PRECISE wording as follows.

1. ONLY the original creditor can place a default on the account, the default CANNOT be backdated placed on an account and cannot exist after 6 years on an account, no matter what the status of that account after 6 years from the default.

2. Should any DCA place any action on an account this should be deemed unlawful under the Unfair Contracts regulation as the original contract is between the debtor and the claimant, not with any agent acting on behalf of the claimant.

3. Should an outsourced DCA be used that DCA has no legal powers to place ANY information on a debtors account because the original contract is with the original creditor and the debtor.

Bet you the lawmakers wouldn't go that far - basically I am saying in a nutshell ONLY THE ORIGINAL CREDITOR CAN PLACE ANY ACTION ON A CREDIT REFERENCE FILE.

[MARTIN3030]

Originally Posted by renegotiation

I will wait until Monday and if I hear nothing will compose my complaint and send it off to the I.C.O.. I will post it up on this thread.

Just for the record, this is the response from Callcredit:

Dear Mr,
Thank you for your e-mail; I am sorry that you did not find my response adequate. I confirm once six years have elapsed on settled and defaulted accounts, the credit account records are removed from all credit referencing databases. However, I further confirm these records are not immediately erased from archives, research datasets, or disaster recovery facilities. I trust this clarifies matters.
Yours sincerely,

It would have been nice to get this response without sending multiple letters and emails though. All my correspondence was completely clear from the off. They seemed to continually think I was concerned about the future of my own ruined credit report and not just a concerned citizen. All they kept on saying was 'it won't be visible on your report', 'it won't be visible on your report'. Well I knew that and the best way to keep it like that is to permanently erase the data after a set period of time.

I am inquisitive also as to why they mention research data sets,and disaster recovery facilities ?

Are they hiding behind something here that can justify their arguements ?

I did a search and found this;

Research - Research Datasets

[SilverLining]

Originally Posted by renegotiation

Callcredit - They don't seem to be contactable by phone apparently!

Here you go - as if by magic!

Callcredit Limited
One Park Lane
Leeds
West Yorkshire
LS3 1EP
t. 0113 244 1555
f. 0113 234 0050
w. Credit report information for consumers - Callcredit | Callcredit - Credit Reports & Credit Advice

Details of number found here:
Callcredit - Consumer Credit Referencing - Contact Us

Maybe a little late but better late than never lol