How will the OFT decision impact on CAG?

[gizmo111]

Originally Posted by millymollymoo

My opinion if the OFT suddenly did a U turn the credit cards/banks would then sue the OFT for the 'extra' money they were forced to pay out.

Or can they not be sued?


Milly X

Not sure what you mean - charges are reclaimed on more than the OFT statement - the law has been settled for a long time.

[MARTIN3030]

There is as much chance of the OFT doing a U turn as there is Citi revealing their costs.......difference being the OFT do not want it done in secret

[callingcard]

Just a few points

Yes, a Judge sitting in a High court can set a precedent, I suspect the Lord Chancellor has a word in the ear of a Judge who is hearing a case where a precedent would be appropriate to ensure a sensible outcome.
If you look at what it says on the wall of the High Court in London "The Royal Courts of Justice" the authority comes from the Monarch and Magna Carta is involved although I understand that only 3 of the original clauses in the 1215 document signed (under duress) by King John are still Law. Also prisons are always "H. M. Prison
" although maybe one day they will be "Prisons plc"

G.

The OFT web site says "The OFT is a non-ministerial government department established by statute in 1973." and their mission is to make markets fairer for the consumer.

If Citigroup do not disclose as ordered by the Judge I assume that they will be in comtemp of court. Although I think they will just pay up and walk away from this case before the 28 days ends. I'll ask an ex Citigroup employee I know if he has any figure for costs of processing transactions/direct debit refusals etc.

Yes, I have posted before tring to explain that the OFT DOES NOT MAKE LAW!!!!

[Bookworm]

Originally Posted by callingcard

Yes, I have posted before tring to explain that the OFT DOES NOT MAKE LAW!!!!

Sorry, didn't quite get that, could you say it again?

[ladybird17]

and never, never forget that you shouldn't confuse the law & justice

[callingcard]

I don't think the OFT can be sued, they are Civil servants. I suspose if an OFT official makes a big cock up that's his knighthood gone

[loverboy]

lol, yes , dont get me wrong im all in favour of dealing a blow to capitalism, indeed im merely playing devils advocate!
The banks do not want to challenge most claims because quite rightly the OFT's investigation is expected to draw the conclusion that it is unfair to charge anything over its recomendation. Now once that has been declared its kind of likle a guide to the banks what they might be able to argue as fair! However as you have mentioned it is true that ultimatley it is for the courts to make a precedent upon (something the banks are currently afraid of too) . personnaly , without playing advocate!! I would say the banks will avoid opening thier books etc and settle out of court, everyone knows it does not cost over £5 max in real cost to the banks.
Having said this as devils advocate, iw ould be keenly examining this report, recomendations , sure their lawyers will be doing so lol
Interesting debate though ??

[loverboy]

actually most precedents are set by county and chancery courts, unless a precedent case gets appealed etc

[loverboy]

who said OFT makes law?

[loverboy]

depends what would you sue for?

[noomill060]

Must be half term...

[give_me_it_back]

I was pretty disappointed with Martin's report on the Tonight programme. I felt he didn't give particularly good advice. Also, not at all useful advice if you live in Scotland - the whole programme was only based on English law.

However, it was nice to be able to put some faces to my favourite names on the board!

Keep up the excellent work all!

[Stornoway]

Originally Posted by noomill060

Must be half term...

Agreed - or perhaps day release ....

[Advoc8]

Originally Posted by loverboy

actually most precedents are set by county and chancery courts, unless a precedent case gets appealed etc

County court binds nobody, chancery is a division of the high court.

[indebtstudent]

Just a little more info, I've been filling in my colleagues at work (Nationwide) about the law and one smart begger made the whole "the charges are not unlawful because they haven't been ruled on in court". I shut him up by saying that the only reason they hadn't been ruled on in court is nobody would defend a case.

What is the score re test cases? Have there just been none?

Back to my topic, my understanding of the OFT decision on credit cards is thus -

We could carry out a long investigation to determine what we will set as the figure but instead lets make it significantyl lover to benefit people now.

I got a charge refunded from MBNA with a letter I constructed myself (before I discovered CAG!) so I would say, if a similar ruling is made re banks charges continue to claim I don't think the banks will defend...

[indebtstudent]

I agree with Advoc8 (clever name - I like a good pun!). Basically what happens is lower court do decide cases but, if they err and it gets appealed, a higher court can give a definitive decision and it is this that sets the precedent. This is why if you lose in the House of Lords you tend to feel a little down (unless you're covered by european law!).

[gizmo111]

Just a little more info, I've been filling in my colleagues at work (Nationwide) about the law and one smart begger made the whole "the charges are not unlawful because they haven't been ruled on in court". I shut him up by saying that the only reason they hadn't been ruled on in court is nobody would defend a case....

The law on penalty's is quite clear and has been settled for a long time -

What is the score re test cases? Have there just been none?

None in a high court, although Citi was ordereded full disclosure in the Mercantile but defaulted and paid the claimant in full.

Back to my topic, my understanding of the OFT decision on credit cards is thus -

We could carry out a long investigation to determine what we will set as the figure but instead lets make it significantyl lover to benefit people now.

Back to my topic, my understanding of the OFT decision on credit cards is thus -

We could carry out a long investigation to determine what we will set as the figure but instead lets make it significantyl lover to benefit people now.

The ydid carry out a long investigation, and they cannot set a figure, the only figure they have set is the point they will intervene.