consumer forums consumerforums Total Bank Charges Returned : £17,500,569 to 10384 people.

Bank Charges Refunds Survey | 'Buddy' System | Get an email address | Registration Problems | FAQ
The Consumer Forums  

CAG Products - We think that these will help you to make your claim or Reclaim your Right

These sales also help us to keep helping YOU and ensure this site will remain free to use!

Small Claims Kit-- Small Claims Court Guide
**New Edition**
Consumer Action Group envelope labels Last Will & Testament Kit Fight a Motoring Ticket
 
Alternatively you could purchase a CAG email address here, or maybe you'd prefer our address labels here


UPDATE: Consumer Forums ConsumerWiki is now LIVE - click here: ConsumerWiki

Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide
An excellent guide for the layperson in how to use the County Court - a must if you are intending to start a claim.
£17.10 + £1 (P&P)

Lawpack - Small Claims Kit
Contains everything you need to sue your bank (or anyone else) including sample forms, instruction manual, templates, and an entire set of court forms in PDF format on CD Rom.
£10.99 + £1 (P&P)

Last Will and Testament Kit
Make a legally valid will without the fuss and expense of a solicitor - includes a full step-by-step guide.
£12.99 + £1 (P&P)

Fight a Motoring Ticket Kit
All the templates and documents that you need to challenge your speeding ticket, parking fine - with advice from one of the UK’s leading motor offence solicitors
£9.99 + £1 (P&P)


Go Back   The Consumer Forums > The Consumer Forums
The Consumer Action Group
> Broadband and other Internet issues

  CAG Announcements
 
Welcome Guest
Please register
Registration is free
There are no charges for using any of the facilities of this website.
If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ. You will have to register before you can post. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.
You will also have to register to access our template letters and claims forms
registration is free
Are you being threatened over debts more than 6 years old?
This may be unfair
See our new Unfair Trading Guide
eBay buyer?
Buy more cheaply
Win more often
ConsumerSniper.com
Have you been defaulted?
Would you like to clean up your credit file?
Check it out
Ebay buyer?
ConsumerSniper
Free unlimited bids and eBay tools
Have you been defaulted?
Would you like to clean up your credit file?
Check it out
 
 

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 18th November 2008, 21:14   #21 (permalink)
Platinum Account Customer
 
Have we helped you? Please help us by making a donation

Cagger since : Jul 2006
Posts: 2,449
patrickq1 Informativepatrickq1 Informativepatrickq1 Informativepatrickq1 Informative
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

WifiZoo v1.3 Released - Passive Info Gathering for Wifi | Darknet - The Darkside

wi fi and how to hack into a secure sytem seems that it can easilly be hacked sucure with windows defender i dont think so so you can see how easy it is for someone or a criminall or a terrorist to hack or piggy back your line
patrickq1
patrickq1 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 18th November 2008, 21:20   #22 (permalink)
Platinum Account Customer
 
Free trial on our eBay auction sniper

Cagger since : Jul 2006
Posts: 2,449
patrickq1 Informativepatrickq1 Informativepatrickq1 Informativepatrickq1 Informative
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

bt by the way have passed on data concerning my wife and i presume they sudpect dowmloading she does nt even know what keyboaed means she thinks it is a organ player but that does not help her so i am writing to DL to let them know it shall be challenged in court i have also sent them a hackers guide just in cade they are unsure of their experts advice that is condiferably dodgy and they do not want to reveal the facts concerning this so any technical college can help you by asking for help that could they send someone to your area and test if your system is secure and if not have a letter from them explaining your faults that what you really thought was secure is really a setup full of holes
patrickq1
patrickq1 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 19th November 2008, 11:10   #23 (permalink)
Basic Account Customer
 
Have we helped you? Please help us by making a donation

Cagger since : Nov 2008
Posts: 6
polmac Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

I just got one of these letters yesterday morning in my fathers name from these people.

they are looking £500 for a download from a P2P site of a music album!

serious £500! my mate got a £200 fine on monday for being caught drink driving FFS!

i have arranged ameeting with a solicitor tomorrow afternoon to let them look at it. my father can barely download his emails and he got this! lol

i cant even rem if i downloaded the album or not and i know for certin i dont even have it anymore nor even burnt it to cd for that matter. The letter has asked me to sign something saying i wont do it again and to send them £500 compensation.

Oh the file was suppostly downloaded in May this year! and i have a wireless network connection as well
polmac is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 19th November 2008, 11:43   #24 (permalink)
Gold Account Customer
 
kiptower's Avatar
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

if you check the high court web site

re the 30th june , strange there no case's for the Cheif Master or any other Master for that date of any case regarding what they are claiming
kiptower is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 19th November 2008, 15:11   #25 (permalink)
Platinum Account Customer
 
sillygirl1's Avatar
 
Our auction sniper is now live. Try it for free

Cagger since : Mar 2007
Posts: 2,094
sillygirl1 Highly informativesillygirl1 Highly informativesillygirl1 Highly informativesillygirl1 Highly informativesillygirl1 Highly informativesillygirl1 Highly informativesillygirl1 Highly informative
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

This lot really need closing down, but unfortunately they have found a 'niche' in the market and are exploiting it for all they are worth If I ever get a letter from them I will reply in the negative and take them to court for breach of data protection - which is basically what they are doing in reverse.
sillygirl1 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 19th November 2008, 16:16   #26 (permalink)
Gold Account Customer
 
kiptower's Avatar
 
Your bank owes you an awful lot more money than you realise See here

Cagger since : Sep 2008
Posts: 465
kiptower Novitiatekiptower Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

they have started a new "CON" now

Filesharing ambulance chasers get into the gay smut racket • The Register
kiptower is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 20th November 2008, 10:47   #27 (permalink)
Basic Account Customer
 
Is your bank avoiding its debts
Data disclosure poll

Cagger since : Nov 2008
Posts: 6
polmac Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

the pdf scan of that letter is the same as the one i got accusing me in the exact same way.

i will let people know how i fared with my solicitor over this matter.
polmac is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2009, 11:07   #28 (permalink)
Basic Account Customer
 
Your bank owes you an awful lot more money than you realise See here

Cagger since : Jan 2009
Posts: 1
Albert_123 Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

Hi Folks,

I received a letter form DL this week and like many I am unable to understand how I could have downloaded or shared the file in question.

The IP address they supplied definately was my static address and could be nobody elses and I have run an open WiFi network for as long as I can remember (now secured after the shock of this letter). It could have come through my DSL line by being shared by a rogue wifi user but I cannot prove this.

I am really unable to determine if this copywrite violation was for sure made from my DSL line as I cannot find the file but with the IP they have given I can hardly deny it. I am inclined to pay the settlement to end the issue once and for all.

I suppose the few questions that I would like answered are:

1) If I pay up will it be the end of it or do these people use any admission of guilt as a way of opening the floodgates for any other scan successes they may have captured?

2) During the time of the scan would they have captured more general information that they have stored in order to keep the ball rolling? Has anyone reported the agreement to pay leading to them just moving onto the next file they logged and trying to get another lump of cash from them?

4) Whether I am guilty or not, is the scanning DL have done conclusive proof that would stand up in court that the file did indeed get shared from my DSL network?

5) Given the situation if I were to contest the case would I be expected to give up any PC's that are attached to the DSL network at my home for interrogation?

6) Is there a group of consumers in the UK in a similar situation who have sought to challenge the acusations in numbers and if so what was the outcome or status of the challenge?

I just want this thing to get resolved and go away but I am concerned that what I can only see the start of multiple claims being the outcome and a whole load of financial hurt.

Thanks,

Albert

Last edited by Albert_123; 29th January 2009 at 11:31.
Albert_123 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 29th January 2009, 15:43   #29 (permalink)
Platinum Account Customer
 
Bookworm's Avatar
 
Our auction sniper is now live. Try it for free

Cagger since : Feb 2006
I am in: spired.
Posts: 20,750
Bookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm Authoritative
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

They accuse, they need to prove: It's not about whether it came from your IP, but whether it was you who d/l the file. With an open network, it could have been anyone, even s/one from the street, so you could write back and say: "Not me, guv, see you in court and be prepared to prove that it was me, and don't bother me again unless you are prepared to go to court and by the way, wasn't the Watchdog programme in which you prominently featured interesting?"

I would strongly recommend you do not part with a penny unless you like giving money away for nothing... (in which case my cooker has just broken down and needs replacing! )
Bookworm is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 1st February 2009, 11:19   #30 (permalink)
Classic Account Customer
 
Have we helped you? Please help us by making a donation

Cagger since : Mar 2007
Posts: 156
MATTYFEZ Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

This might be worth a read if anyone is having problems, the company is well known for is spurious threats:
Being Sued by Atari/Davenport ! - Overclockers UK Forums

a) The letter states with regard to Atari "their copyright works (including the work) are being made available on so called peer to peer (P2P) internet sites.
Implying that there may be more should I pay this one, as i do not understand the implications or even the workings of this peer to peer thing, (not ever having been on one)

b) Am i right in thinking this is a civil offense (should it go that far), as a criminal offense/conviction could have impacts on my profession

c) the other posts on this appear to be from people with the same letter who have perhaps downloaded this game knowingly or others who have no knowledge about it all.
How do i stand in my situation? Such as, am i guilty by default as i pay the bill so am responsible for its use by everyone in the house.

A) This is just a psyche-out, they would have to take seperate action on each alleged offence. I think if they had more evidence, then you would know about it.

B) if the allegations are true, it is a civil offence.

C) This company have approached people who are innocent, and those who are guilty, thier methods are highly questionable in terms of how they select their "victims".

The advent of wireless networking has made it very easy to "jump" onto a wireless network, personal equipment/data is very safe due to firewalls and other security on the computer itself, but it is very easy to utilise sombody elses broadband connection to download information from the internet using thier connection, so it would appear that the "owner" of that connection was doing it themselves. I would be very interested to hear about any real court cases regarding this, as it is very shakey ground.

Peer to Peer (P2P) networking is a really tricky thing, the basic idea is that you download a file (any file) for example BBC IPlayer, but the condition of you downloading it, is that you share it with others.
In very simple terms, a peer to peer network is any collecton of devices that is not controlled by a single device that enforces rules, it is the very nature of networking and the internet. If you have more than one computer in your home, connected by a router, then you have a very small P2P network - there is no central file-server or domain.

The file itself, is broken down into hundreds, sometimes thousands of little "chunks", and you only get one chunk at a time. As you collect all the chunks, you also share the chunks with other people who are connected to the same group or network, and they share thier chunks with you. this makes for a highly efficient way of moving data, as the historical method invoves connecting to a single source to download a single huge chunk of data, which is obviously very limited in terms of speed, as you are relying on a single connection to a "host", rather than multiple connections to hundreds of "peers"

A thousand people sharing small parts of the same data between themselves, rather than from a single source, makes for highly efficient sharing of data, and it is fundamental to modern computing.

Anyway - back on track,

I don't belive any of these cases have gone all the way, as in, they have never been properly defended. I think it would be very interesting to see a case defended, because of the ammount of background work to prosecute would be massive.

The nature of P2P networking means that any given person who allegedly "downloads a file protected by copyright" would potentially be liable for obtaining that file illegaly. which means that they would be liable for £3-£60 depending on the price of the software/music in question. (hardly worth going to court over).

The way people such as davenport Lyons operate, is that they analyse how many "peers" you were connected to at the time, an then boldy pronounce "you were connected to 2500 peers, therefore you have illegaly distributed 2500 copies of our clients material" 2500x£30= lots of money.

In reality, you generally re-distribute less than 1% of the entire file, due to the sheer number of sharers (peers), so if the case went all the way you could only be held liable for the price of the software/media(that you obtained), plus the ammount you shared, so if we take for example, a software item that retails at £100, they would have to prove how much you shared, ( how many chunks did you upload?) lets say for an extreme example, you uploaded 100% of what you downloaded, that means you would be liable for £200 plus costs....and thats a bit ambiguous as I dont belive the technology exists to see who shares how much and to whom.

Last edited by MATTYFEZ; 1st February 2009 at 13:21.
MATTYFEZ is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 25th March 2009, 21:33   #31 (permalink)
Classic Account Customer
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bookworm View Post
They accuse, they need to prove: It's not about whether it came from your IP, but whether it was you who d/l the file.
Not in my case.

I run an PC repair shop. My solicitor (Lawdit) told them that i did not deny it may have been downloaded via my IP address but it was not myself pressing any buttons, more likely to be one of my customers PC's running bittorrent software whilst connected to my network.

DL wrote back saying that did not imply that I deliberately downloaded the said file but that the IP address used was linked to my name and that was all they need.

The latest is they are proceeding with this to court in 14 days time. This despite letters from Lawdit stating they will defend vigorously.

If i loose I will be filing for bankruptcy immediately.
i cant pay the settlement as this would be an admission and thus prevent me from connecting customers PC's t my network ever again.
toxicdebt is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2009, 03:33   #32 (permalink)
Classic Account Customer
 
skonk's Avatar
 
Is your bank avoiding its debts
Data disclosure poll

Cagger since : Oct 2008
I am in: Anfield, Liverpool
Posts: 197
skonk Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

Toxicdebt, am I assuming that when someone has brought their pc into your shop, they could have easily had a bit torrent application set to run at start up, and when it was connected to your network, the bit torrent software kicks in on start up and continues downloading the file the owner of the pc had started?

Keep us posted about what happens in court. Oh, and good luck as well, I hope it works out in your favour.
skonk is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2009, 09:59   #33 (permalink)
Basic Account Customer
 
Our auction sniper is now live. Try it for free

Cagger since : Sep 2008
Posts: 10
DonDino2 Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

I thought Atari sacked Davenport Lyons a few months ago, according to an article published on The Register...?
DonDino2 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2009, 10:07   #34 (permalink)
Platinum Account Customer
 
Bookworm's Avatar
 
Watch out, there are Claims Touts about!

Cagger since : Feb 2006
I am in: spired.
Posts: 20,750
Bookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm Authoritative
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

Quote:
Originally Posted by toxicdebt View Post
DL wrote back saying that did not imply that I deliberately downloaded the said file but that the IP address used was linked to my name and that was all they need.
Well, they would say that, wouldn't they? How are they going to get you to cough up otherwise if they agree with you? It remains that they need to prove (or convince the judge on balance of probabilities, as it is a civil case)that YOU downloaded and distributed whatever it is they accuse you of d/l.
Quote:
The latest is they are proceeding with this to court in 14 days time. This despite letters from Lawdit stating they will defend vigorously.
But will they? Or are they just giving you 14 days to pay up or else they say they will file at court?
Quote:
If i loose I will be filing for bankruptcy immediately.
I doubt that you will, tbh, that is if they do file. Let's face it, with your solicitors involved, you won't be seen as one of the soft targets, so I am rather dubious. Do let us know.
Quote:
i cant pay the settlement as this would be an admission
Why should you if you have done nothing wrong?
Bookworm is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2009, 23:02   #35 (permalink)
Classic Account Customer
 
Where else can you earn 8% interest on your money?
Start your County Court claim NOW!!!

Cagger since : Oct 2008
Posts: 164
toxicdebt Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

Thanks for the replies guys. It really does help. Im going to open a thread entitled Toxic Vs DL and detail my ongoing saga there. I do have one more question tho but...

Will I have to travel to London for the hearing (where DL are) or will I get the hearing in my local court?
toxicdebt is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2009, 07:44   #36 (permalink)
Basic Account Customer
 
Free trial on our eBay auction sniper

Cagger since : Sep 2008
Posts: 10
DonDino2 Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

You should be given the chance to contest jurisdiction before the hearing takes place, in which case there are many arguments you can put forward as to why you would like the case transferred to your local court. Jurisdiction, if properly contested, is usually awarded in favour of the defendant, at least in civil cases.
DonDino2 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2009, 08:53   #37 (permalink)
Platinum Account Customer
 
Bookworm's Avatar
 
We need funds
Please donate something

Cagger since : Feb 2006
I am in: spired.
Posts: 20,750
Bookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm AuthoritativeBookworm Authoritative
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

Quote:
Originally Posted by toxicdebt View Post
Thanks for the replies guys. It really does help. Im going to open a thread entitled Toxic Vs DL and detail my ongoing saga there. I do have one more question tho but...

Will I have to travel to London for the hearing (where DL are) or will I get the hearing in my local court?
If they do issue a claim, you'll be given the chance to ask that the case be transferred to your local court.
Bookworm is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2009, 19:52   #38 (permalink)
Classic Account Customer
 
Free trial on our eBay auction sniper

Cagger since : Oct 2008
Posts: 164
toxicdebt Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

Cheers guys

toxicdebt is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 22nd April 2009, 15:42   #39 (permalink)
Basic Account Customer
 
Try our eBay sniping service

Cagger since : Aug 2008
Posts: 3
Dimlo Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

It would be interesting to hear what happens Toxic.

My mum received a letter in August 2008 and after many written exchanges with Davenport Lyons denying that she ever downloaded the file, it all went very quiet. I did hear that Atari had dropped Davenport after they started chasing people for downloading porn.

Being an IT professional I was convinced that their claims had no substance and that they were just trying to get people to pay the "settlement" fee. As far as I'm aware it is not the law to secure a network and is up to the individuals using it as to what content they download/upload.
Dimlo is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 22nd April 2009, 20:18   #40 (permalink)
Classic Account Customer
 
Try our eBay sniping service

Cagger since : Oct 2008
Posts: 164
toxicdebt Novitiate
Default Re: The Davenport Lyons/Atari copyright saga

Well their allowance of 14 days for me to reconsider and pay up has long passed. Nothing more has come through.
toxicdebt is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter The Consumer Forums Replies Last Post
Davenport Lyons going against file sharers Hamurabi Broadband and other Internet issues 68 16th June 2009 07:28
ISP's releasing personal information - re Davenport Lyons gecko1001 Broadband and other Internet issues 43 31st December 2008 02:30
blake lapthorn tarlo lyons mrmarmite Debt Collection Industry 10 24th August 2007 16:34
Saga Car Insurance Saga less2303 Insurance/Assurance Companies 1 5th April 2007 08:49






Reclaim the Right Ltd. - reg.05783665 in the UK reg. office:- 923 Finchley Road London NW11 7PE