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> Benefits, Tax Credits and Minimum Wage

Benefits, Tax Credits and Minimum Wage Having problems with benefits / deductions, or want to discuss entitlement etc. this is the place. Other matters include Tax Credit issues and also advice for those on / or below minimum wage.


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Old 3rd March 2008, 13:38   #1 (permalink)
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Default Backdating a claim - From when?

I wonder if anyone knows this, or can point me in the right direction.

My local authority states that in order to backdate a claim further than the date from which you put in your claim, you need to have a "good reason", but they, of course, are the ones who will decide if your reason is good enough or not. Guess what, it usually isn't, now there's a surprise.

I am toying with the as yet not fully formed idea that this is not really a very fair way of doing things. After all, if my circumstances are the same 6 months ago as they are now, and I am now entitled to something, it follows I would have been entitled to it then, if you follow me.

The main argument seems to be: "ignorance of the law is no excuse", so if you didn't know you were entitled and you didn't claim, then it's your own fault, you should have known and therefore claimed, which seems a somewhat specious and fragile argument. On the other hand, what should be the benchmark? 6 years, as per SOLA 1980?

I feel there is a flaw in my logic somewhere, then again, I feel there is one in theirs too. I just can't put my finger on it. What I do know is that most of us on this site got somewhere by challenging accepted ways of doing things, so I am throwing this one open. Do your worst.
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Old 3rd March 2008, 14:40   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

What benefit are you interested in? different benefits- different rules. As you can imagine, nothing is ever simple in this area!
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Old 3rd March 2008, 14:53   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

Vast majority of means-tested benefits can only be backdated for 3 months when you submit a late claim (other than a claim for housing benefit and council tax benefit) In late claim situation, the 3 months backdating can be effected if you show that as a result of one of the circumstances listed, you could not reasonably have been expected to make the claim earlier. For housing benefit and council tax benefit similar situations may be good cause for backdating benefit, but the decision will be guided by case law, and other situations may also allow backdating. The specified circumstances are:-
illness or disability
difficulties in communicating
caring for another person
being given wrong advice or information
domestic emergencies and bad weather.

Housing benefit and council tax benefit may also be backdated for up to twelve months if you have 'good cause' for a late claim (there are special rules where the client is aged 60 or over). Good cause is not laid down in regulations. It depends on case law. I will post more on good cause shortly.
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Old 3rd March 2008, 14:58   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

Sorry, I forgot to say, didn't I? Council Tax Benefit.
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Old 3rd March 2008, 15:28   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

Social Security Commissioners have tried to define "good cause". One of the most memorable is the definition of 'good cause' as provided in R(S)2/63(T) – 'some fact which, having regard to all the circumstances (including the claimant’s state of health and the information which he had received and that which he might have obtained) would probably have caused a reasonable person of his age and experience to act (or fail to act) as the claimant did'

In Wall’s Meat Co Ltd v Khan <1979> I.C.R. 52 the Court of Appeal was concerned with an employee’s delayed complaint of unfair dismissal made to an industrial tribunal. Lord Denning MR said (at page 56)
“Ignorance of his rights — or ignorance of the time limit — is not just cause or excuse, unless it appears that he or his advisors could not reasonably be expected to have been aware of them.”
And in the same case Brandon LJ pointed out that there could be good cause for delay if the delay was due to a mistaken belief reasonably held.”
And finally, in CH/4501/2004 the Commissioner decided that a lack of knowledge of the benefits system can be considered good cause for a backdated claim.
This may be helpful: http://www.londoncouncils.gov.uk/upl...backdating.pdf

The legislation background:
Regulation 72(15) of the Housing Benefit (General) Regulations 1987 and Regulation 62(16) of the Council Tax Benefit (General) Regulations 1992 provides as follows:-

(15) Where the claimant makes a claim in respect of [a past period (a “claim for backdating”) and, from a day in that period up to the date of the claim for backdating, he had continuous good cause for his failure to make a claim, his claim in respect of that period shall be treated as made on-
(a) the first day from which he had continuous good cause; or
(b) the day 52 weeks before the date of the claim for backdating,
whichever fell later.]



The following guidance comes from the “Department for Work and Pensions Housing and Council Tax Benefit guidance Manual”.

Meaning of good cause

2A.00 Good cause

• is not defined in legislation a number of Commissioner’s decisions deal with it
• includes any facts that would probably have caused a reasonable person to act as a claimant did, for example:
- The claimants age, health, background and knowledge of the Social Security (SS) system
- Information the claimant
~ had received or
~ could have obtained

2A.01 It is for the claimant to show good cause unless there is an appointee. The claimant’s explanation for the delay in claiming should be considered in the light of all the facts and circumstances.



The following examples of good cause are taken from the “Guide to Housing benefit and Council Tax Benefit 2005-06 by Zebedee, Ward, and Lister”.

5.79 Some examples of when claimant’s may have ‘good cause’ are listed below.
• If the claimant was ill and had no-one to make a claim on their behalf.
• If the claimant could not reasonably have been expected to know their rights, e.g. if there have been detailed changes in the law,
• If the claimant did not understand that they could claim, perhaps because of age, inexperience, language difficulties, difficulty in understanding technical documents or some other reason.
• If the claimant was wrongly advised that they were not entitled to HB/CTB.
• If the claimant was unable to manage their affairs and did not have an ‘appointee’.



Social Security Commissioners Decisions

The following Commissioners Decisions all relate to the backdating of Housing and Council Tax Benefit entitlement and are taken from the Social Security and Child Support Commissioners website:

• CH 5221 2004
• CH 2302 2002
• CH 2659 2002
• CH 393 2003
• CSHC 352 2002
• CH 996 2004
• CH 1791 2004
• CH 4501 2004
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Old 3rd March 2008, 15:49   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

Council Tax Benefit has a backdate limit of 52 weeks.

I was incorrectly advised by a counter clerk that I would not be entitled to benefit as I was not on any benefits and I was self-employed at the time I enquired.

Despite my council recognising this they still rejected my backdate claim and, to rub salt in the wounds, applied and got, a Liability Order against me even though my claim is with an independent panel to rule on.

Apparently that is no defence. So, my claim has still yet to be decided yet a court has already ruled I owe it!

Further, should I be granted backdated benefit then that total will be cleared but I will still have to pay the costs, for an amount I may not have been liable for, and which is more than the backdated amount in any case.

Justice?
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Old 3rd March 2008, 15:55   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

What independent panel is that?
Have you put in a complaint?
Please see Local Government Ombudsman - How to complain
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Old 21st March 2008, 18:23   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joa View Post
What independent panel is that?
Have you put in a complaint?
Please see Local Government Ombudsman - How to complain
I'm not sure, but, I was informed it would go to someone else from the chap who was dealing with it.

Anyway, I have been granted the backdated claim as I had good cause.

However, I have also been sent a demand of £60, which are all costs, for my council bringing a liability claim against me on an amount of money I didn't owe in the first place!

It really is a joke.
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Old 4th April 2008, 13:27   #9 (permalink)
patrickq1
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

my claim for incapacity is being backdated to 2003
although it has taken almost 12 months to get this far but i also have my case being examined by ICE who are looking at the mal administration side of this
also joa when a file is sent to the DECISION MAKER i beleive are supposed to be independant can i ask for a full disclosure of what has been sent
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Old 4th April 2008, 19:03   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickq1 View Post
my claim for incapacity is being backdated to 2003
although it has taken almost 12 months to get this far but i also have my case being examined by ICE who are looking at the mal administration side of this
also joa when a file is sent to the DECISION MAKER i beleive are supposed to be independant can i ask for a full disclosure of what has been sent
patrickq1
Good for you patrick but why 12 months?

However, this thread concerns council tax and the limit is 52 weeks.
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Old 5th April 2008, 16:28   #11 (permalink)
patrickq1
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Default Re: Backdating a claim - From when?

because they denied any sick notes ect was sent they have also lost some paperwork now they are trying to deny this but i have a screen prinout where they state paperwork lost so if its lost how do they know its lost so they shot themselves in the foot with the screen printout,as for backdating you can go back to wherever you have any evidence of a claim...they tried denying me any claim was made fortunitly i kept most of the paperwork and then when the area manager for the dwp TOLD AN UNTRUTH IN FRONT OF MY mp I KNEW THEN I HAD THEM,Aton Origon keep all information for ten years
but the area manager tried to tell me it was destroyed after 14 months this is a load of codswallop i have it oficial from Atos it is ten years,oops sorry it concerns council tax lol just so happens i did not reilise this sorry guys
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