Tax credits problem

[reallymadwoman]

I got this years award notice on 13th August and phoned straight away because it was obviously wrong as payments ended on 31st because my daughter was no longer a child. On the phone I asked why they thought this and after a long pause to read the records was told it was because I hadn't returned the form saying she was going to college. At that point I hadn't mentioned college, presuming they would have had the form which I returned months ago, so how did they know she was staying in education? I was told a revised notice would be sent out.

I haven't yet received the revised notice, but according to the award notice I have I should have had one payment on xxth August and another on the xxth, and I've had neither and I can't get through on the phone!

On top of all that I'm repaying an overpayment from 2004. I went to CAB with the 11 award notices I received that year and even they couldn't work out if the award was correct, but my appeal failed as supposedly I should have known it was wrong. Initally they suspended repayments because I was on income support, but they now want to take nearly £20 a week off me. When I also queried that on the phone I was told I had to pay it and it couldn't be reduced. Last year I got £44 a week, which just about covers the food bill - the only place for any flexibility in the budget - so if they take £20 a week off me we basically won't be able to eat unless my daughter buys the food with her £30 a week EMA, and then she won't be able to pay her fares to get to college! Are they really allowed to take half your payment?

[reallymadwoman]

I finally managed to get through at five past eight this morning after trying on and off all day yesterday.

After a huge rigmarole which involved me giving all of my bank details over the phone (or they wouldn't tell me anything!) tax credits say my bank refused the payments, so it's not their fault! They are putting the payments through again but it will take 10 working days!

I can't think of a single reason why a bank would refuse to accept a payment if the account details etc are correct, so I have doubts about the accuracy of this information, and why would it take 10 days to make a payment?

If anyone can shed any light on this - i.e. come up with a good reason, or any sort of reason, for a bank to refuse to accept a payment - I would love to hear it. Also is there anyone I can complain to about this?

[pinkmoomin]

I think there are some accounts that can't accept external credits - you haven't changed the account number recently have you?

Good luck with them anyway.

They screwed mine up good and proper and after half a year with no payments - and having no notice that I'd lose £500 a month, and then three weeks of phone calls to find out why I had stopped receiving money (they said they'd overpaid me already) - it took me 10 weeks to get payments again once the new tax year started. They're still doing it by giro now.

[reallymadwoman]

Hadn't thought of that one, but the account is exactly the same one that they've been paying in to for at least the last 4 years.

Maybe if they don't sort it out quickly I should go to the DWP and ask for my income support to be increased because I'm not getting tax credits any more, so don't get the minimum income any more. I don't suppose they would pay extra, but if you don't ask ...

[pinkmoomin]

If that's the case then I agree with you, I can't see why it would be refused.

But, if iIcould just butt in about my problems with them again... apparently they can't use the account they'd been using for me for three years either. Apparently, something to do with because the payments had been stoped, reinstating them onto the automated payment system is, it seems, impossible. You could demand a giro be sent to cash at the Post Office (though they will tell you they don't do that anymore.)

As for the DWP - you could, but do try your local Tax Office if you can. I was told they can make discretionary payments if they believe you are entitled to money you are not receiving - take your latest award notice down there. I couldn't do that as apparently there is also a problem with printing out and issuing my notices.

I also got an appointment at the CAB for a couple of days after I actually got my first payment from them - it took about three weeks to get the appointment, but I thought it was worth waiting for at the time. They can help as they have some more direct numbers than the general public can get their hands on.

[reallymadwoman]

I've been having a search around for how to complain, and it's the same as for any tax office - speak to the office, then complain to the manager if you're still not happy, so I think I might do that, but after I get my money! They can pay costs and compensation if it's bad enough, and your case certainly sounds as if it should qualify pinkmoomin.

I'm getting the distinct impression that errors are perhaps being covered up by 'misdirection', both over the original incorrect notice and the payments suddenly stopping, by coincidence at exactly the same time. Would an S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) request be likely to provide any proof that they did get the form I sent originally and payments have not been made for some other reason? Any suggestions as to how it should be worded if it might work? I imagine all the info is kept on computer and is obviously accessible from my NI number so identifiable as related to me.

I'm also pretty sure that they're not allowed to take £20 a week off someone on income support to repay overpayments, especially as they then weren't going to pay me any more tax credits. Where do they think I'm going to get the money from?

[pinkmoomin]

Oh, I spent HOURS searching for info on how to complain! It simply can't be done to the Tax Credit Office without phoning the only number - or writing to them and about a fortnight later getting a standard response asking you to wait a month for a response!

But, I may have needed to make it clearer about visiting the office - try your local ordinary tax office - not Tax Credits office. It doesn't always work, but you can ask to speak to someone regards non-payment of Tax Credit and possibly qualify for an interim payment as long as you have an award notice to refer to. You do have one with valid dates on....

And I wouldn't rely on compensation for hardship after the event either. I didn't get any after losing out on 6 months of payments due to their errors (therefore leaving myself with virtually nothing after childcare bills and making sure my daughter was fed properly) followed by 10 weeks of non-payment of what they kept saying I was due, and after I had told creditors I'd be back to normal at start of the new tax year... you get the idea!

[pinkmoomin]

Oh, re the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request). I don't know about that one. I'm still trying to figure out exactly what they do myself!

[reallymadwoman]

I had to phone my bank about something else today so asked about what Tax Credits said.

Very helpful young lady said she didn't know of any reason why a credit to an account would be refused, and if for some reason it had been, it would show up on their records - and guess what? - nothing! The only suggestion she could come up with was that tax credits quoted the wrong account details.

I have another suggestion. Because they thought my claim was ending, the last two payments due should have been made manually, and they forgot.

I would love to know what's actually on their records about this, just to prove myself (and my bank) right.

[pinkmoomin]

That's interesting, isn't it. I wish I could offer more help other than saying you have to be a pain in the arse and persist with them.

I actually just remebered, reading that, something that happened in April after my first two weeks' payments for this year were missed. I also had to ring the bank as money hadn't arrived after it should have cleared and TCO said it had been sent. The lady at the bank very helpfully went away and checked the clearing account (money goes into a central 'pot' each day and is then dispersed to the individuals' accounts) and nothing.

I think I had two, maybe three more phone calls to TCO before someone figured my details were on my account correctly but not being passed onto the automated payment scedule.

My payments had been stopped and 'restarted', as yours were. I do wonder if your account has suffered the same fate after it was manually restarted and it's now got itself jammed.

I'm an IT professional - I can't imagine how they've let so many obvious flaw(s) remain in their system - I have waited 5 months since the new payment year started and my account is still not correct as I am still receiving monthly giro payments. It's not been able to generate award notices for over a year. Last September whn I first got cut off they were essentially closed for a fortnight while I phoned everyday to find out where my cash was, while they were having system updates. As far as I can see, they broke the system even more!

Who knows how many other people have suffered similar problems and didn't have the persistence/telehone access to be as much of a perst as I was about it!?

Phone every day, and demand to speak to the supervisor. Try and pick a time you think won't be a peak time, such as, maybe 10.00am - a large proportion of claimants will be at work at this time and you won't spend ages on hold - you may even be lucky enough for a supervisor not to have to be taking calls themselves since it's so busy ( )

Write, wait for the standard response and then write back immediately saying you are not prepared to wait for 4 weeks (or the current quoted time) for a response and spell out exactly what hardship this is giving you.

[reallymadwoman]

Update.
After speaking to my bank, I sent off a formal complaint to tax credits, and should expect a reply by 16th October apparently.
In the meantime I've had another award notice giving different amounts, but still saying my daughter is no longer a child! The money has now been paid into my account (two weeks late!) but I'm furious that they still haven't got my award right. I'm sure they will do eventually, and I'll then get all the back pay, but that doesn't pay the bills in the meantime! I feel another irate phone call coming on!

[splashin]

Hello Reallymad
I know why your payment isn't going into your account, it was an error I have seen many times and am shocked that nobody has corrected it there and then for you, (I suppose I'm being stupid to think the advisor know what to do).. Firstly you need to find out a couple of things.
1. What date is input on the start date of your childs further education and did you inform them before this date had elasped? If the start date is correct and it shoud be 01-09-2007 for the system to allow further education run on, anything different won't be recognised. If this date 01-09-2007 is inplace on the system and you told them before 01-09-2007, then the system still won't recognise it because it can not calculate future dates. It needs to be input again. So when you phone tax credits and the advisor says yes the start date for further education is 01-09-2007 and is on the system, tell them to take the date out and re-input the same date 01-09-2007 again. It should then be able to calc a new award from that date. Tax Credit computer cannot deal with future dates only dates that have passed.
With regards to the bank and not accepting the payment sent, Bulshh! That would never happen, it was never sent. But it bemused me over the years how advisors thought they had updated the system correctly. These people had started work with me and should have been really on the same level of knowledge as me, knowing about the system. On the section were your bank details are held there is a start date box at the bottom of the page. I don't know how many times I came across advisors inputing todays date into it to satrt payments back into accounts. This box was there and would be updated with that days date automatically, if the details had been input correctly. Never once did I type the date into this box, the computer automatically done it for you. But also there could be underlying probs as to why it doesn't auto fill the start date. If I came across this then it meant that there was a verification failure against your NI number, which had to be cleared first before any updates were accepted by the system. A verification failure (something not correct) can be caused for practically everything and any change you may make. So with regards to your childs change of circs, you may have told them the actual date school started (say for instance) 4th Sept, this would create a failure because your claim for CTC ended 31st Aug (Last day over 16's entitled) If the start date is 3 days after this date 31st Aug it can't work it out. It must be the day after the end of entitlement to understand this claim is to carry on.
Please let me know if you get any further.
Splash

[splashin]

P.S
Please take look at the following link, so many useful people avail to help you out with Tax Credit problems.
Taxcreditoverpayment@blue yonder.co.uk

[DigbyD]

I had a huge tax credits overpayment last year. Whoever took my details down over the phone missed out a decimal place when entering my salary and I had two huge payments go into my account. I rung straightaway to say "Take them back" but they refused to let me send them money straightaway, saying that someone would be in touch about "collection". The money still sits on my tax credit award notice as "overpayment to be collected".

I am currently looking into the rules about overpayments where it is the fault of the tax credits office.

[splashin]

Well that was really nice of them wasn't it. They just love to mess it up. Proving your innocence is the hard part. They will deny any wrong doing and say it was you who told them you earn 200.00 per year and not 20000.00. Hello Hello Hello Tax Credits, do you have chimpanzies answering the helpline phone. Who in the right mind would work all year for 200.00 !!!!! If you had of told them this I am sure the advisor dealing with your call would question this amount there and then, but I don't suppose a chimp would know who earns what. Dispute this to the hilt. What stage are you at now? Do you still have the money or has it been spent on wicked and wild things?
Check out this link it is really helpful and responses are quick Taxcreditoverpayment@blue yonder.co.uk
Splash

[reallymadwoman]

I have now received a corrected award notice and am waiting for the first payment. Also still waiting for a reply to my complaint, but it's only been a couple of weeks so far!

[splashin]

Hi Mad
When should payment be in your account? if its not in by the weekend there is still a fault, but hey lets not be pesamistic afterall HMRC said so. lol..
Well done on getting it sorted and don't give up your ongoing complaint. Splash