Plastic bags outlawed by Smiths ...

[forgottenone]

Shopping at a city WH Smiths recently ... now you've to to pay 1p for a carrier bag as it's now considered 'extra' *and straight into Gordon Browns stealth tax money box of course* ... Today, at another Smiths, I was told that the bags will soon be stopped. Oh, dear ... so how are shoppers supposed to carry things home, then?

I mean, when it rains ... your newspaper is going to get so soggy within seconds ... or you magazine.

Sainsburys also now ask you if you've brought any bags with you and, if so, how many.

Okay, all well and good. But what are they going to replace the bags with? They've had pretty sturdy, well made paper bags in America for decades for groceries, shopping ... doesn't seem to have done them any harm.

Or will we see more shopping trolleys go walkabout from Tescos, Sainsburys ... as no bags, so people have to get their shopping *if on foot* home.

What next I ask?

[barracad]

Originally Posted by forgottenone

Or will we see more shopping trolleys go walkabout from Tescos, Sainsburys

Doubtful as a lot of trolleys nowadays have a chip in them so that the wheels lock if you try and take them out of the perimeter of the car park.

[blue4ever]

Tesco Banbury don`t have plastic bags,have to by their bag4life
i went in to WOOLWORTHS and bought 3 items went to till and the cashier said"WOULD YOU LIKE TO BY A PLASTIC BAG FOR 3 PENCE)
NO
Went out of the shop with items under my arm

[Jemn]

Can somone explain why plastic bags in a hole in the ground is so much worse than crude oil in a hole in the ground?

[kennythecelt]

Originally Posted by blue4ever

i went in to WOOLWORTHS and bought 3 items went to till and the cashier said"WOULD YOU LIKE TO BY A PLASTIC BAG FOR 3 PENCE)
NO
Went out of the shop with items under my arm

This raises quite an interesting point.

Whilst I am firmly against waste and understand the pollution, landfill and sustainability issues etc, walking out of a shop with items under your/ my arm will surely put many more people under suspicion of shoplifting, if they don't purchase a bag. I asked a member of staff in TK Max about this as they are introducing charges and she only said, yes, I suppose so??

I understand why there are charges for plastic bags but I am not too happy paying for them. Need to stock up on cotton/ reuseable ones.

[skbuncks]

Hi Jemn

Originally Posted by Jemn

Can somone explain why plastic bags in a hole in the ground is so much worse than crude oil in a hole in the ground?

[/lecture mode on]

Crude oil doesn't live in holes but rather in porous rock deep underground in which it accumulates. It is then prevented from escaping by a non-porous rock on top, or cap rock. So unless we come along and drill for it then that is where it stays.

With carrier bags we first have come along, drilled for oil, extracted the oil, refined the oil, taken various components of the refined oil and added various chemicals and additives to it before polymerising and setting into the shape of the plastic bag. The bag is then transported from the manufacturing facility to a warehouse and from the warehouse to the shop of intended use. We then use the bag, maybe reuse it a couple of times, then through it away. It is then collected, drove to a refuse depo and then buried in a land fill. Then, for the cases of non-biodegradable plastics, they hang around in the hole for thousands of years. Biodegradables will degrade over time (variable, anything from months to years). As you can appreciate this lengthy process consumes a hell of a lot of energy.

So to answer you question, although they are both made up of basically the same things (lengthy carbon chains), it takes absolutely no energy or effort to leave oil where it is but to put a bag in a hole takes vast amounts of resources and energy consumption all contributing to so called 'climate change'

[/lecture mode off]

skb

[kennythecelt]

Slightly off topic, but need for safe disposal is shown here.

[sea-sidelady]

We were told in a local asda as from this week they were stopping normal bags, and you will have to buy bags for life from now on.

I don't know if its all asda's or just that one.

But how many people remember to take bags in to the stores with them. They should have signs up in the car parks or on the doors to remind customers.

[forgottenone]

Charged 1p today in Smiths, again. I can see this being a problem for many elderly people ... as they don't always, nor can TBH, keep abreast of current 'trends' ...

As we live in the 'age of wonder' where sheep can be cloned, and we are breaking the genetic code(s) ... one solution could be to somehow engineer bags that did biodegrade without destroying the environment ... or 'global warming'. Which is mostly natural anyway, product of the planet's own evolutionary cycle. And influences from our sun. Increased sun spot activity every few years can cause climate changes. Just one. Geothermal and tectonic plate movement another.

[revolting peasant]

I work for one of the big supermarkets and we are actively discouraging the use of plastic carrier bags and offer a recycling service for bags from any source. As far as I'm aware we don't have any plans to stop providing free carrier bags but they are rapidly becoming an "under the counter" product.

[gyzmo]

I just carry my own bags anyway - rarely have need to ask for one in store.

[gyzmo]

Oooh! and if getting cans or bottles with the plastic holder on them, please cut it up before disposing - animals, esp. birds can get trapped in them.

[sequenci]

Originally Posted by gyzmo

I just carry my own bags anyway - rarely have need to ask for one in store.

This.

[foolishgirl]

I am totally incensed by this issue!

Yes, I agree wholeheartedly that the use of PLASTIC bags should be curtailed but why are these so called 'green' & 'environmentally aware' stores not giving out BROWN PAPER bags instead?

I am old enough to be able to recall a time before the plastic carrier & brown bags for everything was the norm as indeed it is in a lot of stores in USA. In fact, some US stores offer you 10c (5p) per bag for every bag you've reused, not just some extra promotion points that mean little or nothing to most customers & therefore do not actively encourage recycling - pennies in the pocket do.

This is just another excuse for the retail industry to make additional profit from the sale of a bag in which to carry home the goods we have purchased from their stores & from which they have already derived profit. No wonder they're on GB's side, they both stand to make - profit & tax!

WH Smith is just one store that should be named & shamed - the airport shop I recently used would only sell me a bag - but National Trust is another. I visited one of their historic houses a few weeks ago & purchased a couple of beautiful hardback books in their shop. It was pouring with rain & as they were too large for the rucksack I had with me asked for a plastic bag to keep them dry as I carried them to the car, a walk of approx. 250 yards. I was told I would have to pay 25p for a very expensive looking NT carrier. When I asked if I could have one of the thin plastic carriers at the side of the till to prevent my purchases getting wet I was told that these were only for plant purchases. So it appears that NT think it's just fine for books to get wet but plants must stay dry!! Huh?!!

This is obviously another PC idea that hasn't been thought through & we consumers must take a stand NOW before this practice spreads - no plastic, paper please or we don't use your store. Make a point of complaining to the manager of any store that does this then maybe with enough complaints the message will eventually get through to CEO level.

[Spiceskull]

I am all for 'deposit paid' on things like bags, bottles and cans...I remember the times as a kid, scavenging for old Cresta bottles, and getting 5p back for each one.

The problem with bags is...well...I don't think anyone really knows what the problem is. If you look clearly then I guess the problem is that they are used, and then carelessly discarded...in terms of carbon footprint they are negligible, so the 'green' message is lost...unless you consider the 'green' view of garbage.

Me, I go to a supermarket, and load about 30 things into the trolley. I then unload to the conveyor, and let my goods pass through the till...if I do not get a free bag (or bags) to transport my goods home, then I refuse to pay, and walk out of the shop...

What really irritates me is that I am expected to pay extra for 'necessary' packaging, like bags, but that I am not given a choice to not pay for unnecessary packaging, such as multiple layers of plastic/cellophane around the goods I buy...

The green and environmental issue of supermarket plastic is a two-way street...let the supermarket demonstrate their committment first, then I will follow on afterwards...

[Thailand]

I doubt Primark would ever think like this (although I think they use brown paper bags) because they know that bag is free advertising, in fact they are absolute buggars for trying to force you to have one, or at least they used to be. I'm always sceptical of 'green' policies as our government teaches us it is a fantastic way to wring more tax out of us, but if Asda, for example, is happy to let us advertise any old company instead of thier own - is it really worth the possible demise of thier brand presence since not all supermarkets are doing this...yet.

I only know Primark have brown paper bags because I've noticed them knocking about (I'm not a snob for not knowing as a a customer, the quality has gone downhill!)

Often thought about doing the same Spicey....... £££'s in your till for free carrier or go back and put it on the shelf, that's going to cost a hell of alot more than an assumed 0.5p carrier...

[foolishgirl]

Originally Posted by Spiceskull

What really irritates me is that I am expected to pay extra for 'necessary' packaging, like bags, but that I am not given a choice to not pay for unnecessary packaging, such as multiple layers of plastic/cellophane around the goods I buy...

The green and environmental issue of supermarket plastic is a two-way street...let the supermarket demonstrate their committment first, then I will follow on afterwards...

AGREE!! Much more goes in my bin from fruit/vegs/toys etc. wrapped, shrink wrapped, double wrapped, easy wrapped etc.etc. than I ever get from the plastic I carry home in. Morrisons are one of the wors offenders - they shrink wrap cucumber & then wrap it again & why do they have to plastic wrap bananas FGS?? They come with their own biodegradeable wrapping - it's called skin.

Originally Posted by Thailand

if Asda, for example, is happy to let us advertise any old company instead of thier own - is it really worth the possible demise of thier brand presence since not all supermarkets are doing this...yet.

I remember lots of companies used to do this in the 1950/60s by supplying brown paper bags printed with their advertisments to shopkeepers either free or at v. low cost. The old ideas are the best!

[forgottenone]

Oh, well ... am I bovvered? Nope! Well, not since they started putting £5 off tokens in the afforementioned carrier bags now ... be putting them to good use soon. Some hardbacks I want, which are expensive but with the money off ... under a tenner! Some Smiths are charging, not all, though. Seems to be major city stores.

Come to think of it, I've not had any of the HMV booklet tokens they used to shove in your bag around Xmas.

[barracad]

Originally Posted by foolishgirl

Yes, I agree wholeheartedly that the use of PLASTIC bags should be curtailed but why are these so called 'green' & 'environmentally aware' stores not giving out BROWN PAPER bags instead

This is a joke, right?

Paper bags use up much more energy and resources than plastic bags, so if they were being 'environmentally aware' why would they give out something that was more harmful to the environment??

[foolishgirl]

No it's not a joke. Paper can be obtained from renewable resources & degrades rapidly - it's wonderful in my compost heap!! That doesn't mean it's completely green but then life ain't green either or perhaps we should all stop eating, breathing, living?