Abbey new Part 18

[GaryH]

There is now a new part 18 request to send to Abbey on receipt of the new 'no breach' defence. Everyone who receives the new defence should send the request below, even if you do not wish to follow it up by subsequently applying for an order.

Please use and report back any responses ASAP. Thanks.

CLAIM NUMBER: *******

In the XXXXXXX COUNTY COURT

Between:

[YOU]

Claimant

-And-

ABBEY NATIONAL PLC

Defendant

_________________________ ______

REQUEST FOR INFORMATION AND
CLARIFICATION UNDER CPR PART 18
_________________________ __________ ___

DATE OF SERVICE: [date sent]

This request for information under CPR part 18 is served notwithstanding anticipated future track allocation. I believe that the court would consider this request as appropriate in the context of clarifying matters fundamental to your defence. In the event you ignore or do not comply fully with this request an order may be sought obliging your compliance, or alternatively, an application may be made to strike out the defence as disclosing no reasonable grounds for defending the claim.

1. Please confirm that "the conditions" referred to in paragraph 1.2 and 2 of the defence is the contractual document relevant for the purposes of this claim and pursuant to the provisions of which each charge now reclaimed was applied.

2. With due regard to clause 6.3 and clause 6.4 of the conditions which governed the account in question and pursuant to which each charge now reclaimed was applied, please provide clarification of the following matters;

a) In respect of paragraph 4.1 of the defence, please clarify precisely upon what terms such a "loan" would be advanced to the customer, in particular for what period such a loan would be provided, and provide full details in relation to each charge.

b) In respect of paragraph 5 of the defence, please provide further information and full details of the "proper construction" to which you refer, including a brief summary of the evidence and matters to be adduced at trial in order to support such a construction.

3. In paragraph 5 of the defence, you state that; "It is averred that clause 6.3 of the conditions operates as a trigger to bring into effect certain other provisions of the conditions." Please clarify the specific provisions of the conditions to which you refer.

4. Please state catagorically whether or not you consider that the claimant had authority under the contract to at any time exceed the contractually agreed overdraft limit without prior arrangement.

5. Please confirm that you consider the provision of the "loan" referred to in paragraph 4.1 of the defence to be a service, and as such derive profit from the charge arising from the event you consider a service.

6. Please confirm whether charges are applied automatically or manually or otherwise.

A full response to each and every point of this request should be served within 14 days, by [date].

Please note that the response must be verified by a statement of truth.

See here for more information -

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...ce-charge.html

[GaryH]

Bump!

Anyone used this yet? I'm itching to know what they reply with!

[bloomingflower]

Hi GaryH

can I still use this new p18? as I have an allocation Hearing on the 26th Sept,and Abbey have already sent me their New Defence for my 2nd and 3rd claims,
... I have Abbeys Old defence for my 1st claim... 4th claim at AQ Stage)

Thankyou

Flower

[GaryH]

Yes absolutely - you can, and should.

Let me know how they respond.

[bloomingflower]

Hi
im sorry to be a pain:o
What date do I put in this following section? as I have only 9 days before my A/H and it says to give them 14 days....


A full response to each and every point of this request should be served within 14 days, by [date].

And is it best to send it on its own or include it in the C/B?

flower

[GaryH]

Put;

"A full response to each and every point of this request should be served in advance of the forthcoming allocation hearing which is on **/**/**."

Send it on its own ASAP by e-mail and recorded delivery.

[abroadgirl]

HI PLEASE CAN ANYONE TELL ME DO I JUST FILL OUT THE XXXXX AS WE NORMALL DO THEN PRINT THE WHOLE CPR18 out and fax / email to abbey tyvm
abg

[GaryH]

Yes, copy and paste into word, fill in the claim and personal details etc then send it off.

Only to be used with the new 'no breach' defence though.

[abroadgirl]

thankyou so much for ur quick reply i have donr that but sorry to be thick here
what does no breach defence mean
sorry for not understanding
tyvm
abg

[GaryH]

Abbey's old defence (before August) was to say the charges were imposed as a result of breaches of contract and that they were a pre-estimate of administration costs. Para 8 of the 'admin costs' defence;

The fees reflect and are proportionate to the Defendant's administrative expenses incurred due to the Claimant's breach of contract and are a genuine pre-estimate of the damage suffered by the Defendant.

Since August they have been issuing a new defence which denies a breach and basically says that the charges are a service charge. Para 3/4 of the 'no breach' defence;

3. It is denied that those charges payable and that rate of interest applicable upon a customer going into unauthorised overdraft or exceeding an authorised overdraft constitute a penalty at common law. It is denied that those charges and that interest are payable on breach of contract.

The part 18 above is only valid for the latter, the new 'no breach' one.

[abroadgirl]

thankyou once again for your quick reply garyH
if you dont mind can u take a look in my thread as to abbey i have to type everything as my scanner wont work gggggrr

hope you dont mind tysm
oh sorry its
abroadgirl v abbey
hope u dont mind me asking
abg

[bloomingflower]

Hiya

I have just completed my CPR18 for both my 2nd and 3rd Claims,(as I recieved their New Defence for both claims) and I will be sending one copy off by post (signed for)and one by e-mail....

With regards to the "Old" Witness Statement do I just delete the paragraph in red which refers to the CPR18? (The "New" Witness Statement doesnt have the paragraph in red..)

Do I need to refer to the CPR18 in the "Old" defence? (if I have to send one, or shouldnt I send one?) as I read it is only for the New Defence?

Sorry, I am a bit confused!

Thankyou for your help in advance

Flower

[GaryH]

Originally Posted by bloomingflower

Sorry, I am a bit confused!

I know the feeling!

Here's a part 18 you can send for the old defence -

New strategy v Abbey - CPR Part 18 Requests

So now you can leave the red part in the witness statement.

I'm going to add stuff to the 'new' witness statement, so check back a couple of days before your hearing and hopefully I'll have done it by then.

[bloomingflower]

Hi Gary

I would like to say thankyou for your help,you have been a complete star
yes,i will check back before I go to my hearing. I cant wait to see what Abbeys response to your CPR18 will be,(if I get one )

I will let you know what happens....

Thankyou once again Gary

Flower

[bloomingflower]

Hi Gary

I thought I would give you a quick update. I emailed the CPR18 yesterday to Abbey(Inga,Claire,Ronan) and I got a message from the Postmaster..
saying there has been a delay in sending the e-mails.. What does that mean??Does it mean they are not recieving any more e-mails or what?


Also,please can you tell me where I could see a copy of the OFT Test Case POC? as I cant find it..

Thankyou Gary

Flower

[GaryH]

Hi Flower

I've no idea about the e-mails. Just pop a copy in the post as well.

Heres the OFT POC -

http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/bus...s-of-claim.pdf

[abroadgirl]

i sent abbey inga kirkman cpr 18
and i got a letter back saying
to this end abbey national plc will not be responding to your request for the information and clarification under cpr18 at this time

hugs abg